quote:

quote:
First off, it's not nor has it ever been a pandemic.

That is absolutely, positively, unequivocally, categorically false.

Pandemic
A pandemic is an epidemic of an infectious disease that has spread across a large region, for instance multiple continents or worldwide, affecting a substantial number of people.

As with many political arguments, apples and oranges are being compared. Michael's argument is academic, it doesn't meet the accept definition, and Colorado's is logic, it hasn't risen to the medical impact to be a national emergency.

quote:

Originally posted by Canted Valve:

quote:

quote:
First off, it's not nor has it ever been a pandemic.

That is absolutely, positively, unequivocally, categorically false.

Pandemic
A pandemic is an epidemic of an infectious disease that has spread across a large region, for instance multiple continents or worldwide, affecting a substantial number of people.

As with many political arguments, apples and oranges are being compared. Michael's argument is academic, it doesn't meet the accept definition, and Colorado's is logic, it hasn't risen to the medical impact to be a national emergency.

I agree with CR, the numbers do not seem solid, too much fuzziness. Maybe people would be less pessimistic if a solid explaination was given. I do know of person being admitted with broke leg (family member) and being tested 4 days in a row. They actually tested twice 2nd day to get a positive result. Since person with broke leg had zero symptoms, can only deduce looking for covid numbers. How real are the numbers?

My personnal doc has changed his position, likely due to med assoc dictates. I cannot blame him.

No doubt this has had neg impact on many and I cannot discount those lost. We lost one but also understand that every flu season was a major challenge for her due to health issues.

The 82 year old vaxxed family member living in ALF got positive test and had a mild stomach bug. Daughter in law unvaxxed was flu symptoms for 3 days, son vaxxed was flu symptoms 5 days and 12 year old grandson sick same as son never tested positive.

Too many unanswered questions on this whole situation.

I know of two deaths that were listed as covid, yet were not. One was a car accident, the other a murder suicide. Both were "thought to have been positive" so were listed as covid deaths. Neither were ever verified. Yet you expect me to believe the numbers? Total bs. Most deaths listed as covid were from underlying causes. I stand firm on the statement that 650,000 did not die FROM covid. They may have died WITH covid, but not all FROM it. There is much much more being covered up and kept away from us than most realize. This was never ever about your health or safety. It is purely a power grab and takeover of the US, believe it or not.

quote:

Originally posted by Coloradoracer:
I know of two deaths that were listed as covid, yet were not. One was a car accident, the other a murder suicide. Both were "thought to have been positive" so were listed as covid deaths. Neither were ever verified. Yet you expect me to believe the numbers? Total bs. Most deaths listed as covid were from underlying causes. I stand firm on the statement that 650,000 did not die FROM covid. They may have died WITH covid, but not all FROM it. There is much much more being covered up and kept away from us than most realize. This was never ever about your health or safety. It is purely a power grab and takeover of the US, believe it or not.

EVERYONE has their own opinions about all of this,but just wanted to let you know that your views are in line with mine.There is a political component to this that is hard to deny.

quote:

Originally posted by Canted Valve:


"With Newsom poised to win California recall, another indication COVID politics may be starting to favor Democrats over Republicans
The recall verdict could have national implications for both Democrats and Republicans heading into the 2022 midterm elections."

I do not doubt it..

Voter fraud already happening

Dave

Dr. Fauci himself admitted a year ago "you cannot force someone to take a vaccine."

Jen Psaki admitted "it is not the government's role" to mandate vaccines.

Joe Biden said he didn't have authority to issue sweeping vaccine mandates.

They did it anyway. What does that tell you?

quote:

They did it anyway. What does that tell you?

Ugh, they are quick learners?

"Obama said 22 times he lacks power to change immigration law."

quote:

Originally posted by Canted Valve:

quote:

quote:
First off, it's not nor has it ever been a pandemic.

That is absolutely, positively, unequivocally, categorically false.

Pandemic
A pandemic is an epidemic of an infectious disease that has spread across a large region, for instance multiple continents or worldwide, affecting a substantial number of people.

As with many political arguments, apples and oranges are being compared. Michael's argument is academic, it doesn't meet the accept definition, and Colorado's is logic, it hasn't risen to the medical impact to be a national emergency.

The "apples and oranges" is in conflating two completely different arguments. Covid-19 is a pandemic. That is absolute fact, period. YES, influenza, when it spreads over multiple continents, is a pandemic. YES, the flu kills tens of thousands of people. ZERO people have argued otherwise, so the presentation of these strawman arguments is bizarre.

Just because something is a pandemic doesn't mean it is a national emergency.
Just because something is a national emergency doesn't mean it is a pandemic.

At no point have I ever argued that government overreach was warranted or even legal or constitutional in many cases. OF COURSE covid has been politicized. That was clear from the very beginning. They live by the mantra "Never let a good crisis go to waste."

quote:

My personnal doc has changed his position, likely due to med assoc dictates. I cannot blame him.

Mine too it seems. He leads the covid task force at our local hospital, and it an all around decent doctor. But man he was all sorts of bought into the vaccine push for everyone. Granted he sees the worst of what has happened working in the hospital covid ward. But when the mandates came down, he changed his tune a little. He is not for that.

As far as died with or died from....
It's a tough one IMO. If someone dies from something completely unrelated to covid, of course that ought not be counted or even considered in the picture.
But, if someone with diabeties who is living life well and practically has another decade of life ahead of them, gets covid and it gets them, should that be counted? They would still be with us without getting the WuFlu. What about the nursing home resident who is bed ridden and no quality of life. How would we count that one? Who makes these calls? I have a stomach disease that makes me at times, immunocompromised. If it gets me, with covid or not? Some of the number gathering fiasco is unintentional. Some of the number presenting and misrepresenting certainly is.

We go for 2nd shot later. Have heard 2nd may well be more discomfort.

I do not seeing what is happening, may well be good time to be old.

Just from my own personal experience at 72 years old, getting both the moderna shots, no side effects at all. My wife at 71, had no side effects with the first shot,a slight headache and fever for a day after the second shot, and 3 days of flu like symptoms after the third shot, but the onset of the symptoms werent until 2 days after the shot. So, Muggs,you might feel a little worse after the second shot, but my wife has health issues anyway so that might have something to do with it.

Exactly why we capitulated and got vax. We will have to travel into NE later this year.

I do wonder what next move will be if inability to eradicate pushes major vax resistant variants. Attended training classes explaining need to finish full antibiotic courses to detroy infection completely and prevent variants from developing resistance. Cleaning/sanitizing chemicals rotated on a schedule to prevent resistance at pharma I retired from.

I spent a few minutes looking at infection rates of various countries, and comparing them to vaccination rates in those countries. I didn't really see a trend. Thinking if I have a chance I will make a scatter diagram.

Why This??

Dave

quote:

Originally posted by David Covey:
Why This??

Dave

Gotta save it all to treat gorillas...

COVID-19 infections spread through gorillas at Atlanta zoo

Ducky the NC zoo has already treated the gorillas here

Opinions about the vaccine aside, we are doing it all wrong IMO.
Look, regardless of anything, there will be some people that won't get a vaccine regardless of intimidation, or mandates, or science, or politics or whatever. So instead of kicking sand, and name calling and division....why not look at other options for the 1/2 to 1/3rd of the country who hasn't jumped on board?
What about science? What about recognizing that a good portion of our population has antibodies that should be considered? How about making testing and data about this widespread? I saw someone mention the word "punitive" in the way that the administration is forcing this upon the people. That never gets you anywhere with Americans. It's a bad plan.

And another thing: All this calling of Biden and Trump as "dictators". That **** shouldn't be possible under our form of government. The executive order deal has been perverted to the point where our government is not running the way it was intended at its core. I don't care who is in charge. That aint right.

quote:

...our government is not running the way it was intended at its core.

In additions to executive orders is the perversion of the many bureau's we have and the same-as-law regulations they dispense. Federal bureau's date back to the mid 1800's, and like everything else they have been perverted. Our Senators and Representatives have gladly given up their responsibility to legislate by passing laws, and let the bureau's take the heat for unpopular regs.