After looking at the video again, I'm going to change my thoughts on this particular incident and say that the guy got what he deserved. 18 seconds he waited! Johnny schooled him. That's an expensive lesson to learn, but I bet he's not going to take forever to stage anymore.

quote:

Originally posted by Mark Yeager:

quote:

Originally posted by TD6297:
but back to the original question. I have seen both the first and second light of the stage light, was the one that started the autostart. Would it have been the first, or second?

It was the second blink. There was a complete review/explanation in the tower (with video) for the racer that was timed out.

Yes, it was the second blink that looked long enough for Autostart to "see" the Stage Beam was blocked long enough to start the process (the 7 seconds for the other lane to stage). The other lane should have been paying attention, or got in first.

In Top Bulb racing, non Pro-Tree, does it really matter WHEN you stage? Seriously? Just roll-in and put your finger on the TB button, when you see the other guys stage light on and stay on, then mat the throttle.

For us Footbrakers running in S/P without any electronics, or Pro Tree, then things change.....

I am very familiar with Autostart, but always wondered if the 7 second timeout (or 10 seconds) depending on the class, and how they set it up (I have seen lot's of cornfusuin in the tower!) included the .6 seconds for Autostart to "see" the stage beam was broken and stayed broken long enough......

In other words, do you have 7 seconds, or actually only 6.4? (Or instead of 10, only 9.4)?

I don't goof-around so I will never get caught!

Ed can show a timeslip from Lebanon Valley where he was timed-out by .0001 or something crazy like that from years ago. Again, that is what lead me to question is the minimum stage time included within the 7 or 10 seconds.

Mike Beck...knows.

Mike remember as well when I was timed out at ETown, first pair out after ultra crash 8 when the tower forgot to reset the autostart timeout from 7 to 10 seconds and they admitted it? Cheryl was part of that conversation as I recall.

So, the “Take Away” from this costly abject lesson is, when the stage light in the other lane comes on, even if it flickers.........Get IN.

Bob

Only if you want a chance to win...

My viewing of the video has me believing that the final activation of the stage light was by turning the wheel. If that is the case, he should have been DQed. The last movement has to be forward. Turning the wheel to activate the stage is not a move forward.
The guy waiting to stage last all the time probably got what he deserved but that wheel movement tactic is not a legal stage and certainly not in the spirit of a fair drag race.

???Really? If the wheel is turned such that the leading edge is BEHIND the stage beam, and turning it causes the leading edge to move forward, breaking the beam, that is by definition....a forward move. Thereby making it LEGAL, and shrewd.

Much like the hidden ball trick, it only works if the trickee is not paying attention and/or doesn't know the rules. The player got played.

RIP

Nothing was illegal and the promoters stated such. If the fella staged his car after he turned the top bulb on we would have nothing to talk about. Instead he decided NOT to stage.

You can not win if you don't stage your car. Nothing was illegal nothing was unfair under the current rules. Both cars must stage for a fair race to occur.

quote:

Originally posted by SC4400:
???Really? If the wheel is turned such that the leading edge is BEHIND the stage beam, and turning it causes the leading edge to move forward, breaking the beam, that is by definition....a forward move. Thereby making it LEGAL, and shrewd.

Where do you find that definition? The car did not move forward.
Biondo surely knows where the rule came from of the last move forward.
It was their sandbox and their call to make. My call, which does not matter, would have been different. Let him try that at a divisional or national and I think he will find a different result.

That is what happens to you when you let the other guy run YOUR race!

quote:

Originally posted by RPROGAS:
So, the “Take Away” from this costly abject lesson is, when the stage light in the other lane comes on, even if it flickers.........Get IN.

Bob

That is so true Bob, my biggest reason for the original question, was in regards to the timing. Because, which started the autostart is good to know, to not get caught off guard by the tree if it ends up really long or something.

The only car to move forward to fully staged in this race was Johnny's...he won because of it.

quote:

Originally posted by jimv245:
That is what happens to you when you let the other guy run YOUR race!

EXACTLY!

quote:

Originally posted by AZ:

quote:

Originally posted by SC4400:
???Really? If the wheel is turned such that the leading edge is BEHIND the stage beam, and turning it causes the leading edge to move forward, breaking the beam, that is by definition....a forward move. Thereby making it LEGAL, and shrewd.

Where do you find that definition? The car did not move forward.
Biondo surely knows where the rule came from of the last move forward.
It was their sandbox and their call to make. My call, which does not matter, would have been different. Let him try that at a divisional or national and I think he will find a different result.

I'm just guessing here, but I think the intent of the rule is that the final motion cannot be backward. This would ensure that a car would not inadvertently launch in reverse.

If, by turning the wheel bringing the leading edge of the tire forward, was the last motion, how would you describe the motion when enforcing the rule your way and saying it contradicts the rulebook?

I think the forward motion rule is so you can't back in and turn on BOTH lights.

NHRA rule:

"THE FINAL STAGING MOTION, USING APPLIED POWER, MUST BE IN A FORWARD MOTION, GOING FROM PRE-STAGE TO STAGE POSITION (this procedure does not apply to motorcycles)."

Note: Rule is in all caps in the rulebook.

Matt,

One could argue, he did indeed, roll forward (just as the rule states) and turn on the stage light but quickly turned the wheel to turn it back off.

There is nothing written about turning the wheel once the stage light has been lit.

What about cars that back up when they mat the gas on the transbrake. Their last motion isn't forward?

If I bring the rpm up higher than 1500-1600 while bumping in, when I set the brake, the car will rock. Am I illegally staged too?

It's all open to interpretation of the rules.

quote:

Originally posted by Tom Reyer:
It's all open to interpretation of the rules.

He 'applied power' to his steering wheel to move the leading edge of the tire forward.

Rule #1 race your race
Rule #2 stage your car
Rule #3 refer to rule #1

If you do this, your likely to not get timed out. Also increase your odds of being able to beat Johnny Bracket Racer.

quote:

Originally posted by TORQIN:
Rule #1 race your race
Rule #2 stage your car
Rule #3 refer to rule #1

If you do this, your likely to not get timed out. Also increase your odds of being able to beat Johnny Bracket Racer.

Here's a Big Surprise TORQIN is dead on again ....