No pushback here. Just wondering why there is no description as to how it works. I wouldn't buy an engine from a builder because they say its good. I would want to know why its good.

Example - New tire comes out, tire company explains why the compound is better and what its intent is, and how its going to function better than a previous model.

Compulink has only said they've invented something and its going to supposedly make tree readers obsolete. No description of how its going to work.

And before the comment comes up saying "if they tell everyone people can work around it" I would say if whatever its doing is randomized, it cannot be worked around consistently.

If it has a randomization of repetition of 10, then a tree reader has a 1 in 100 chance of guessing correctly. 1% chance they can guess it correctly will not be good enough to use it, therefore making the tree reader obsolete.

quote:

Originally posted by DragRaceResults:
I'd say if this doesn't affect you or your racing during the lap and can possibly stop someone from cheating you or your buddy this should be fully supported. Not quite sure of the pushback.

EXACTLY

You think no one is cheating you are pretty naive. We raced many races with the "Dirty Dozen" and knew something was wrong but did not know what. When they got exposed all I could think about was how much money they had stolen from the rest of the racers at these then big events. But if in fact this deal works I will bet some of the current consistent winners go away. I say just install it and let them bleed, I don't need to know how it works or who it catches only that it does. According to the notice at the top of this page this equipment is available now. Let the crying begin.

And don't forget that the guys caught with lead weights inside the walleye last season were Federally Indicted due to the amount of money they were winning by cheating.

quote:

Originally posted by Tom Reyer:
I don't think it's push back really. We, as racers, would like more info on this alleged cheating device, how it works and what the new update to the system will do to stop it.

Who has been caught with one? When were they using it? Can you show us evidence with or without naming the individual?

I'm curious how one focuses the device solely on the top bulb and no other light affects the release of the transbrake?

Without any proof, it is hard to comprehend there may be people using such a device.

Exactly what you and Curtis said.

I'm just a curious person, then a cryptic posting of a time slip in a comment only invited questions.

It's all good. I believe everyone knows they don't need any gadgets to watch me f-up a run in my lane.

Did anyone ever race at a track with Top Bulb Oscillate Software?

I don't think I've ever heard of that. Please explain it.

Top Bulb Oscillate (Full Tree): This feature allows the track operator to set the computer into a mode that makes the top amber on the Christmas Tree never come on at the correct time. The second and third bulbs operate as they normally would, but any driver with a delay box trying to leave off of the top bulb will never be able to cut a consistent reaction time. This helps the track operator by eliminating the need to police cars for delay boxes in classes where no delay boxes are allowed. This is also a good deterrent to people trying to cheat.

quote:

Originally posted by 442OLDS:
Top Bulb Oscillate (Full Tree): This feature allows the track operator to set the computer into a mode that makes the top amber on the Christmas Tree never come on at the correct time. The second and third bulbs operate as they normally would, but any driver with a delay box trying to leave off of the top bulb will never be able to cut a consistent reaction time. This helps the track operator by eliminating the need to police cars for delay boxes in classes where no delay boxes are allowed. This is also a good deterrent to people trying to cheat.

I just copied and pasted this.
But I have a question.How does it not screw up the legitimate racer if he is a bottom bulb racer?

quote:

Originally posted by 442OLDS:

quote:

Originally posted by 442OLDS:
Top Bulb Oscillate (Full Tree): This feature allows the track operator to set the computer into a mode that makes the top amber on the Christmas Tree never come on at the correct time. The second and third bulbs operate as they normally would, but any driver with a delay box trying to leave off of the top bulb will never be able to cut a consistent reaction time. This helps the track operator by eliminating the need to police cars for delay boxes in classes where no delay boxes are allowed. This is also a good deterrent to people trying to cheat.

I just copied and pasted this.
But I have a question.How does it not screw up the legitimate racer if he is a bottom bulb racer?

Because the 2nd and bottom amber are not affected.
If you're racing bottom bulb, it's not an issue.

That's 20 year old news.

"Dirty Dozen" Well it has been a very long time but if I remember right someone came up with a way to help them electronically better run the number same as a Delay box helped on the tree.
When Delay boxes first came out many thought that was cheating. Then along comes Matty box. I do not think it was specifically banned until news about it came out?
Was ANYONE ever actually caught cheating with a Matty box on their car?
A Matty box from my understanding is able to measure the wheel speed and send a signal to driver if you were going over or under the dial. Then they could slow down car if they were going to run under the number.
What does the MSD 7531 or Grid ignition do? Basically same thing and more it actually can eliminate driver part and help make car run number.

I am certainly not standing up for the Dirty Dozen but was it actually illegal WHEN they were doing it? I think that it was not specifically against the rules until right around the time they banned the Dirty Dozen. Are you absolutely sure they were actually doing what they were accused of? Were they doing it AFTER it was banned? Was anyone caught with it on the car? If so what is different from Matty box and MSD 7531? Except of course the MSD can do it from a laptop and not need driver input. Was the 7531 illegal when it was first developed and sold? No. They soon moved to ban it in most classes after they found its capabilities. Same with Matty box. What about Traction control? Some could even say same for Delay boxes. There was a time when people first started holding numbers others thought they were cheating until they learned how it worked.

I do not remember the exact timeline but for years I think Nitrous was not banned in Pro Stock and several were using it. Then word got out and it got banned and some got caught. If I remember right someone got caught with it before they actually specifically banned it in Pro Stock causing them to ban it. Now we all know it was cheating but they look at the rule book and they knew it was pushing the line BUT it was not ruled out in the book.....

Right now many of us right here are throwing down some excellent packages and are NOT cheating. Were those guys just good and ahead of their time?

Back to the original topic here I think we absolutely have the capability to do tree sensing but in my opinion it would be bulky, hard to hide and NHRA has already specifically banned it. Plus I think it would be subject to false starts due to camera flashes, reflections etc. Should anyone get caught with tree sensing they should be dealt with harshly because it is specifically against the rules.

quote:

Originally posted by Curly1:
Right now many of us right here are throwing down some excellent packages

not you! you're a club racer where a .100 bulb is killing it!!

^^^Translated....I'm a bitter old man that's a keyboard racer, that cuts 0 bulbs!!^^^

2BKING

quote:

Originally posted by Goob:
Because the 2nd and bottom amber are not affected.
If you're racing bottom bulb, it's not an issue.

LMAO! That would be true if you were blocking the top two. A lot of bottom bulbers are still 'rhythm' racers, whether they even know it or not. I don't follow the tree down, just stare at the third, but a variance in the top bulb will absolutely throw me off. Every time I've been bit by CrossTalk errantly being on, I've been .040-.045.

The top bulb variance was introduced into NHRA Div. 1 in 1992, when they first legalized delay boxes. Some tracks ran the minimum variance, so it didn't really do anything. The Bracket Finals was a different story. Jim Harrington won the Bracket Finals in Tom Dauber's dragster, blocking the tree with his left hand, letting go with his right, and grabbing the wheel as it left. In Kentucky and surrounding regions I've heard it referred to as a "Joker Tree".

broke dyck, I’ve rebuilt my car for me and I’ll be back in the seat soon, leaving off the top and turning on win lights!

Now tell us again how you are racing the million but have never competed in the actual million, rather you’ve been an also ran since the first fling there, competing in Pro

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 1320racer,

Yep, NHRA Div 1 had a staggered top bulb when they first allowed delay boxes.

The staggered top affected both drivers since you actually had to cross over back then.

You really had an advantage if you could double hit the tree on a cross.

Some local racers even figured out that when the score board reset, the tree would activate. But then we had lightning and they turned of the boards so you had to release when the win lights reset.

Those were fun days back then and made for great racing. You really had to be on your game with incandescent bulbs, stagger, having to cross, no blinders, etc.

I wish they never invented cross talk. This is one thing that really was not necessary.

quote:

Originally posted by Holytown:
I wish they never invented cross talk. This is one thing that really was not necessary.

Amen!!!

10 years in the tower watching good racers go .00x on the tree in time trials, and be .04x - .06x when switched into elimination mode. It always looked bogus to me, most times both racers in the pair would be similarly late.

Races were probably turning out correctly, but the numbers were horrible looking.

One of the dozen turned in their race analyzer aka Matty box to Bill Bader. Citing guilty conscious he layed it all out for Bill. The story is out there, Google it.

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
broke dyck, I’ve rebuilt my car for me and I’ll be back in the seat soon, leaving off the top and turning on win lights!

Now tell us again how you are racing the million but have never competed in the actual million, rather you’ve been an also ran since the first fling there, competing in Pro

That's cool. You should have match races all over soon. LOL Starting with him.