quote:

Originally posted by Bucky:
My question to Larry is: What should we be doing as a nation to avoid the problems you observe? Will those actions help much without the rest of the world participating? What is the solution you propose?

I really wish Larry would comment on this. Therin could lie some common ground. I try to base my opinions on what we know. We know that the earth is warming. What we don't know is how much affect man is having on this warming. Larry can't prove that it is a lot, and I can't prove that it is a little. I think the answer is therefor: Finding ways to reduce emmitions and carbon fuel usage that do not destroy economies. But don't run around messing up people's lives based on a hunch. Just like we shouldn't ignore the problem based on my hunch.
So Larry; What are your suggestions?

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Originally posted by Bucky: We know that the earth is warming.

No we don't!

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Originally posted by stanman:

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Originally posted by Bucky: We know that the earth is warming.

No we don't!

Most research shows clearly that we are and have been on an overall warming trend. I don't have a problem with that. We go though both cylical and noncylical warming and cooling trends as a planet and have done so long before man was a thought. There is also some pretty good evidence that degradation of the ozone layer contributes to global warming, and some evidence that emmisions contribute to the open area in the ozone layer. But how much is way beyond the ability of our current research to say.
Are we warming? Looks like it. Is it a problem coming? It may be. Are we creating the problem? Impossible to say for sure. Maybe, maybe not.

quote:

quote:
Originally posted by Bucky: We know that the earth is warming.

No we don't!


Greg Stanley

Looking at the big picture, I would say we have been experiencing "global warming" since the end of the last ice-age.????

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Originally posted by Bucky: Most research shows clearly that we are and have been on an overall warming trend.

You mean the bogus research that has been used to the push the man-made global warming agenda!? Or the B.S. from Al Gore!? Or the research from the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change that has been roundly rebuked!?!?

You've bought into the leftist media agenda hook line and sinker. For every "research project" from a global warming alarmist there is one or more from actual climatologist and geologist to rebuff it. Check out some of the work by Don Easterbrook, Professor Emeritus of Geology at Western Washington University as just a start.

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Originally posted by stanman:

quote:

Originally posted by Bucky: Most research shows clearly that we are and have been on an overall warming trend.

You mean the bogus research that has been used to the push the man-made global warming agenda!? Or the B.S. from Al Gore!? Or the research from the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change that has been roundly rebuked!?!?

You've bought into the leftist media agenda hook line and sinker. For every "research project" from a global warming alarmist there is one or more from actual climatologist and geologist to rebuff it. Check out some of the work by Don Easterbrook, Professor Emeritus of Geology at Western Washington University as just a start.

Whatever your view is, you can find at least one researcher who has produced data supporting your view.
I listened at length to a professional weatherman locally. Climate change came up, and the only thing he would say is that the data collected in recent history shows warming, and there is evedence around the world that supports that. But he refused to buy into laying blame deal. He said we just don't have the data to support that. I think that is level headed, scientific thinking.

Not a single bite on the wind farms thing? I'm impressed/disappointed! LOL

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Wind farms cause climate change. There's no such thing as free energy. Studies have conclusively shown that the turbines of wind farms slow down winds, disrupting the natural patterns of isobars, creating greater disparities between high and low pressure systems, which generates a cycle of high temperatures and droughts that are only pushed out by increasingly violent storms.

Sorry. Lets not forget the poor birds that fly into the turbines.

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Beard:
Not a single bite on the wind farms thing? I'm impressed/disappointed! LOL

I have not seen the report/s but it makes perfect sense. I don't know how there can be any significant long term data. Do you have a link?

Ask anyone that has been near a large solar array about the ambient temperature in the vicinity. Based on purely anecdotal evidence I can tell you that the ambient temperature within a mile of the large solar generating station near Kramer Junction in the Mojave Desert was significantly warmer than the rest of the surrounding area.

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I have not seen the report/s but it makes perfect sense. I don't know how there can be any significant long term data. Do you have a link?

That's better!

No link. I made it up.

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Originally posted by Michael Beard:

quote:

I have not seen the report/s but it makes perfect sense. I don't know how there can be any significant long term data. Do you have a link?

That's better!

No link. I made it up.

Nobody bit on it. It was a pretty good effort though.

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Beard:

quote:

I have not seen the report/s but it makes perfect sense. I don't know how there can be any significant long term data. Do you have a link?

That's better!

No link. I made it up.

There are some recent studies about wind farms and increased ground temperature in Texas.

Not made up...

WSJ - Wind farms increase ground temps

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generating station near Kramer Junction in the Mojave Desert was significantly warmer than the rest of the surrounding area.

Good point. That place always seems warmer when traveling through there than the areas around it.

Here, we present new evidence based on maximum latewood density data from northern Scandinavia, indicating that this cooling trend was stronger (−0.31 °C per 1,000 years, ±0.03 °C) than previously reported, and demonstrate that this signature is missing in published tree-ring proxy records. The long-term trend now revealed in maximum latewood density data is in line with coupled general circulation models indicating albedo-driven feedback mechanisms and substantial summer cooling over the past two millennia in northern boreal and Arctic latitudes. These findings, together with the missing orbital signature in published dendrochronological records, suggest that large-scale near-surface air-temperature reconstructionsrelying on tree-ring data may underestimate pre-instrumental temperatures including warmth during Medieval and Roman times. The website of Johannes Gutenberg University Mainz published a more reader-friendly explanation of the study Monday:
Professor Dr. Jan Esper's group at the Institute of Geography at JGU used tree-ring density measurements from sub-fossil pine trees originating from Finnish Lapland to produce a reconstruction reaching back to 138 BC. In so doing, the researchers have been able for the first time to precisely demonstrate that the long-term trend over the past two millennia has been towards climatic cooling. "We found that previous estimates of historical temperatures during the Roman era and the Middle Ages were too low," says Esper. "Such findings are also significant with regard to climate policy, as they will influence the way today's climate changes are seen in context of historical warm periods." For the first time, researchers have now been able to use the data derived from tree-rings to precisely calculate a much longer-term cooling trend that has been playing out over the past 2,000 years. Their findings demonstrate that this trend involves a cooling of -0.3°C per millennium due to gradual changes to the position of the sun and an increase in the distance between the Earth and the sun.
"This figure we calculated may not seem particularly significant," says Esper. "However, it is also not negligible when compared to global warming, which up to now has been less than 1°C. Our results suggest that the large-scale climate reconstruction shown by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) likely underestimate this long-term cooling trend over the past few millennia."
Americans sweltering in the recent record-breaking heatwave may not believe it - but it seems that our ancestors suffered through much hotter summers in times gone by, several of them within the last 2,000 years. A new study measuring temperatures over the past two millennia has concluded that in fact the temperatures seen in the last decade are far from being the hottest in history.

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There are some recent studies about wind farms and increased ground temperature in Texas.

Here lately, I don't know how you could tell. Hell is cooler at times than it is in Texas.

Well I haven’t had the opportunity to stir this pot as often or as well as I should, so here we go.

Climate 2013: Perspectives of 8 Scientists

Sea ice around the North Pole melted away to record-breaking levels over the summer of 2012, surpassing the previous 2007 record by 293,000 square miles — an area about the size of Texas.

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Well I haven’t had the opportunity to stir this pot as often or as well as I should, so here we go

Arent you the clown who makes money off global warming?

The Earth is changing. As it has since its creation.

Where are all the DRR armchair experts that don't believe the earth is warming?

Still stuck on stupid................

Oh look, Butt Sucking BobH shows up.