quote:

Originally posted by "The Bender":

quote:

Originally posted by TORQIN:
WTF ED...back to calling people's equipment a POS...you have done it to 2 members in 2 weeks...you know some consider YOUR operation chit...they dont call you out on it...just an observation.

Be humble your kid won a divisional SC championship...you were an assistant and bankrolled the efforts. Congrats to you guys, no need to brag cuz your efforts speak volumes to your commitment.

A lil respect goes a really long way without all the crap you choose to spew. Mr King and Mr Dodson have been responding respectfully...cant you?

Your stripes wont change but do you have to go right back to what got you gone from here in the 1st place? No, you don't...its a choice.

YOUR car never ever broke a thing as long as you owned it?

Chill man, we can all get along without the POS BS.

Well put Chris.

I agree & I'm really trying to be more tolerant of his comments. I never wanted him to leave & I'm glad he's back. Will he ever learn, not based on his long forum record.

I'm not here to learn anything, I'm here to educate those that want advice those that want to improve their program.

Bucky, Hoosier has several tires/compounds that have been and continue to be used successfully in TD and TS. Keep in mind that the first NHRA Top Dragster and Top Sportsman National Champions, did it on Hoosiers 5 years ago in 2015.

FWIW, I ran the C2055 34.5/17 tires for years going 4.70s winning a Championship and a decent amount of races with them. The dragster was deadly with them and you could get 300 passes out of them. Tried a set of c1500 15/34.5 because they had two passes and were dirt cheap. This was a couple years ago right when we stepped up and started going 4.50s and I couldn't hit the tire hard enough to keep it from shaking when we bracket raced. But around division 5, a decent chunk of successful Top dragster guys can make that tire work and I've seen bracket guys make it work too (see the Lemens). But I also won a National and Divisional Event in Super Comp with the C1500, so it's not a junk tire. We switched back to the c2055 when we picked up some more power and went low 4.40s/7.00 smooth as glass but I would say the tuning window gets a lot smaller.

All of this to say, the tire you run is just another part of the entire car setup, you can make any tire work bad. I know people who couldn't get the Bubba to work but the Hoosiers did and vice versa. I've heard overall great things about the Bubba (besides the air issue but that seems to be becoming less common) so I don't think you can go wrong with using them.

good post^^^

I also say that unlike most bracket racers and some class racers, I'm not afraid to turn any of those 4 bars or reposition them, that connect my chassis to the rear end housing or make adjustments to my shocks, I can get down any track!

These tire threads never disappoint

quote:

Originally posted by pretzles:
FWIW, I ran the C2055 34.5/17 tires for years going 4.70s winning a Championship and a decent amount of races with them. The dragster was deadly with them and you could get 300 passes out of them. Tried a set of c1500 15/34.5 because they had two passes and were dirt cheap. This was a couple years ago right when we stepped up and started going 4.50s and I couldn't hit the tire hard enough to keep it from shaking. But around division 5, a decent chunk of successful Top dragster guys can make that tire work and I've seen bracket guys make it work too (see the Lemens). We switched back to the c2055 when we picked up some more power and went low 4.40s/7.00 smooth as glass but I would say the tuning window gets a lot smaller.

All of this to say, the tire you run is just another part of the entire car setup, you can make any tire work bad. I know people who couldn't get the Bubba to work but the Hoosiers did and vice versa. I've heard overall great things about the Bubba (besides the air issue but that seems to be becoming less common) so I don't think you can go wrong with using them.

Great post. Anything you learned about your setup that lent itself to avoiding shake on any of those tires?

One thing I have noticed on all the tires folks like for avoiding shake is the larger diameter. I believe the compounds you were running are only available in 16" rims. The exception for me was the 15" rim 10.5 m/t. But...it was easier to get a little wheel speed on that tire because of its size.

I have also heard the generalization that you can't dead hook a fast car without shake. Was that your experience?

My 4 link car has always hit the tire harder than I would prefer. I can move bars around to manage that further. My shake is usually the situation where it leaves hooked, and then 25' out or more when it starts rolling hard with power, it shakes, sometimes knocking the tire completely unhooked.

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
good post^^^

I also say that unlike most bracket racers and some class racers, I'm not afraid to turn any of those 4 bars or reposition them, that connect my chassis to the rear end housing or make adjustments to my shocks, I can get down any track!

What does the car run off the stop?

quote:

Originally posted by Big Steve:
These tire threads never disappoint

You guys that run "ludicrous speed" can keep the tire moving regardless! LOL.
Have you run fast on any Hoosier? Or M/T's only? Hardtail if I remember correctly.

quote:

Originally posted by Bucky:

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
good post^^^

I also say that unlike most bracket racers and some class racers, I'm not afraid to turn any of those 4 bars or reposition them, that connect my chassis to the rear end housing or make adjustments to my shocks, I can get down any track!

What does the car run off the stop?

been 7.16 @ 186 IIRC

I should have asked 60' time Ed. 7.16 is about where I can run usually without issue. Push the early time any harder and I am in trouble. I'm on the 18260.

quote:

Originally posted by Bucky:
I'm not into defending or attacking anyone here. Keep in mind though that some folks here (some really great people) will not let the past go, ever. Some even have stuff in their signature just to poke their finger in his eye. And, Ed will respond.

I tend to call a spade a spade. Ed is very opinionated, and tends to not leave room for other opinions. And that tends to turn folks off, and sometimes worse. He obviously has knowledge about bracket racing and the wherewithal to put together a winning team. His approach to racing and mine are often different. Fine with me. Different strokes. If you don't like his input, put him on ignore and don't read his stuff. I think most would admit that the irritation towards him started the moment he started posting again. I don't want to ruin a thread with Ed stuff. But this seems to quickly be coming to a head again. And frankly there is plenty of blame to go around.

Speaking of agreeing or disagreeing: I stated before that I have decades on the Hoosiers and they have treated me very well. But...until recently, none of their tires would work for most cars running faster than low 7's. Even now, most of their tires won't work on most of those cars. Again, if there is a trick to making any of their tires not shake when you lean on them, I would love to hear about it. It's interesting how often you see Hoosiers for sale with very few runs on them, on a car that recently started going faster. My approach may have to be to roll out easy and run harder on the rest of the track, or switch tires.

Happy hump day!

Bucky

First, you can't make something do what it's not capable of doing, meaning using the 33.5 Hoosiers on a high power car. Ya you can crutch them but if the goal is to go fast then that is the wrong tool to use!

As far as getting any tire to work on a car with enough power to shake the tires, its about wheel speed, understanding and controlling it! If you can't or don't, you will only get lucky every now and then and make down the track with a good run no matter what tires you use. As for tires, I have used them all over a number of years and the MT's by far, are the most user friendly tire out there, especially for dragsters. That said, it's and easy choice for me. I put a set of MT 3186's take offs from a friends fast TS car over ten years ago and haven't looked back since!

As for wheel speed and dragsters. You can't create it, control it and tune it without a wheelie bar! You can play with this and that but the bar is the key! Go watch the TAD cars! So for a TD type dragsters your taking about, without a wheelie bar, you can & will stick the tire at the hit and if it don't like it or can't handle it, bam you got tire shake. From my many years of experience racing this deal, the Hoosier's can't consistently handle that but the MT's can, period! That's one reason why they are on well over 75% of the TD cars out there.

So pick your poison and move on. And let Ed be Ed, and BTW, they did call MT for a tire sponsorship!

Al, WE did not, so please stop the BS and I have yet to see you go more than a few rounds, no mind win a TD race at an NHRA Divisional on your emp-tees.

Bucky, 1.04 IIRC the 18790 34.5/17

quote:

Originally posted by pretzles:
FWIW, I ran the C2055 34.5/17 tires for years going 4.70s winning a Championship and a decent amount of races with them. The dragster was deadly with them and you could get 300 passes out of them. Tried a set of c1500 15/34.5 because they had two passes and were dirt cheap. This was a couple years ago right when we stepped up and started going 4.50s and I couldn't hit the tire hard enough to keep it from shaking when we bracket raced. But around division 5, a decent chunk of successful Top dragster guys can make that tire work and I've seen bracket guys make it work too (see the Lemens). But I also won a National and Divisional Event in Super Comp with the C1500, so it's not a junk tire. We switched back to the c2055 when we picked up some more power and went low 4.40s/7.00 smooth as glass but I would say the tuning window gets a lot smaller.

All of this to say, the tire you run is just another part of the entire car setup, you can make any tire work bad. I know people who couldn't get the Bubba to work but the Hoosiers did and vice versa. I've heard overall great things about the Bubba (besides the air issue but that seems to be becoming less common) so I don't think you can go wrong with using them.

See my previous post! You will NEVER be able to hit the tires hard enough to not either shake or do another burnout! There is no reason for a 4.50 dragster to shake the tires! NONE.

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
I'm not here to learn anything, I'm here to educate those that want advice those that want to improve their program.

In order to educate, you have to learn how to stay on the Forums. The people who have met you in person. There seems to be nothing but positive feedback about your attitude. Seems like you would learn to do that on the Forums.

quote:

Originally posted by TOP38:
There is no reason for a 4.50 dragster to shake the tires! NONE.

THAT I agree with.

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Al, WE did not, so please stop the BS and I have yet to see you go more than a few rounds, no mind win a TD race at an NHRA Divisional on your emp-tees.

Bucky, 1.04 IIRC the 18790 34.5/17

Ed,,

Someone is lying!

And I will stack up my racing career to yours any day if you want to go there.

yes your source!!!

you still ain't done shyt in TD. lets stack big checks with your and my name on them.

quote:

Originally posted by Bucky:

quote:

Originally posted by pretzles:
FWIW, I ran the C2055 34.5/17 tires for years going 4.70s winning a Championship and a decent amount of races with them. The dragster was deadly with them and you could get 300 passes out of them. Tried a set of c1500 15/34.5 because they had two passes and were dirt cheap. This was a couple years ago right when we stepped up and started going 4.50s and I couldn't hit the tire hard enough to keep it from shaking. But around division 5, a decent chunk of successful Top dragster guys can make that tire work and I've seen bracket guys make it work too (see the Lemens). We switched back to the c2055 when we picked up some more power and went low 4.40s/7.00 smooth as glass but I would say the tuning window gets a lot smaller.

All of this to say, the tire you run is just another part of the entire car setup, you can make any tire work bad. I know people who couldn't get the Bubba to work but the Hoosiers did and vice versa. I've heard overall great things about the Bubba (besides the air issue but that seems to be becoming less common) so I don't think you can go wrong with using them.

Great post. Anything you learned about your setup that lent itself to avoiding shake on any of those tires?

One thing I have noticed on all the tires folks like for avoiding shake is the larger diameter. I believe the compounds you were running are only available in 16" rims. The exception for me was the 15" rim 10.5 m/t. But...it was easier to get a little wheel speed on that tire because of its size.

I have also heard the generalization that you can't dead hook a fast car without shake. Was that your experience?

My 4 link car has always hit the tire harder than I would prefer. I can move bars around to manage that further. My shake is usually the situation where it leaves hooked, and then 25' out or more when it starts rolling hard with power, it shakes, sometimes knocking the tire completely unhooked.

For the C2055s, they just worked with any setup. We stayed between 5.50 - 5.75 psi (tire pressure is a whole other can of worms lol), and whether we were going 4.70s at 2100 lbs or low 4.40s at 1900 pounds they worked. I will say though that the faster you went with them, they got finicky. I tried to get greedy towards the end of last year and raised the launch from 4500 to 5200 to try to get into the 6's and they did not like that very much but I didn't change anything in suspension or tire pressure which looking back I should've. When I went 7.02 it was a 1.01 60 ft and it was smooth so I would imagine if I made some other changes it would've went down the track much better.

With the c1500s, I didn't have enough power/suspension set up/converter aggressiveness to keep the tire spinning as the car drove out. I was able to get initial wheel speed but couldnt keep it going so 30ft out or so it would shake, and it would shake like a mother trucker. When I had them on going 4.70s, I was able to settle them down to just quiver and although you could feel it the car was absolutely deadly, and it was on a cold track to. When we started going faster I had to go all the way down to 4 psi to get them to just quiver and even then it wasn't great. In general our car's have softer "super comp" style converters in them, so keeping wheel speed is a problem. I wasn't necessarily to open to the idea of changing suspension and converter to make those tires work because I knew the c2055s would, but if I wanted to I'm sure I could've gotten them to work.

You're correct that generally you don't want to dead hook a fast car, or that's at least what I've heard from my faster buddies (dragsters or door cars).

The C2055 is an excellent compound. FYI...a good friend and marketing partner with one of the quickest/fastest TDs in the country runs the same 18790 34.5/17 tire I do and has been 3.65 @ 204 and 5.91 @ 244

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
yes your source!!!

you still ain't done shyt in TD. lets stack big checks with your and my name on them.

OK Ed, I will play your game for a minute. I have a trailer full of them, one from Moroso too! You know that place right and the big races they used to have there in November! You must have some form there too, right?

Ed, really, can't ya just be nice. We all are stuck home these days. I hope this deal blows over and we can all get back on the track. BTW you still owe me a Sausage/Pepper sub!