quote:

Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
Here is a question. Why has everyone gone to MLS? Where the composite gaskets giving you a problem? If you are running boost then I get it but just curious.

Curtis

P.S. as an OEM manufacturer I can tell you that I won't tell someone to re-use something that if they do it wrong will come back on me.

Good question and comment.
I only went mls because I needed extra thickness and durability when we added boost. If I weren't adding boost, I would still be using the regular fel pro's at a lower cost and with good reliability. And for the record, when I used them, there were times where I reused one in a pinch, and it never failed.

The uncoated mls's are a bit tougher to seal by themselves in my experience. Spraying the outside layers helps. And I have reused the mls gaskets and sprayed them under boost, with no issues thus far.

I agree, if I were selling or making gaskets, no way would I suggest reusing. Of course I want to sell more gaskets. But also, there is greater risk of them failing upon reuse. What is the up side to suggesting that in that position? None.

But as a practical user, I have chosen to re use, and it has been fine. I don't carry spares right now because I intend on changing pistons and using a different gasket after this season. I'm not opposed to some level of failure risk with head gaskets considering the cost, and while sorting out this combo. If in the middle of a points chase, my thoughts and feelings and risk allowance would be different.

All that said: When copper gaskets were a thing, guys would use those almost indefinitely. The stainless ones are much tougher. As long as you refresh the sealing areas, they ought to be fine.

Couple of comments.

On re-using them, need to consider the power level of the motor, the more power the more change of failure with reuse. Is it really worth it...?

If I were at the track and had to take a head off and reinstall it, I'd use new gaskets if available, but if not, and in a situation racing at a big buck multi race far from home, I'd use the old one if it looked good! At a local bracket race, nope, pack up and go home and install new one.

But when building or freshening a new engine, new gaskets for me, always! There are many ways to save a buck but this isn't one of them for my motors.

Know it all Ed once again looks like a idiot

quote:

Originally posted by TOP38:
Couple of comments.

On re-using them, need to consider the power level of the motor, the more power the more change of failure with reuse. Is it really worth it...?

If I were at the track and had to take a head off and reinstall it, I'd use new gaskets if available, but if not, and in a situation racing at a big buck multi race far from home, I'd use the old one if it looked good! At a local bracket race, nope, pack up and go home and install new one.

But when building or freshening a new engine, new gaskets for me, always! There are many ways to save a buck but this isn't one of them for my motors.

Yes! They were new last time and this time I bought two sets.. stocker motor.. 427- 630 hp 12.2 Comp.

quote:

Originally posted by TOP38:
Couple of comments.

On re-using them, need to consider the power level of the motor, the more power the more change of failure with reuse. Is it really worth it...?

If I were at the track and had to take a head off and reinstall it, I'd use new gaskets if available, but if not, and in a situation racing at a big buck multi race far from home, I'd use the old one if it looked good! At a local bracket race, nope, pack up and go home and install new one.

But when building or freshening a new engine, new gaskets for me, always! There are many ways to save a buck but this isn't one of them for my motors.

As I have stated and EXACTLY!!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 1320racer,

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Rietow:

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Brian, that's because you're not a broke dyck nor a dumbazz.

That's them estrogen filled melons you carry around under your T - shirt everyday, talking.

Don't you have a cone to go run over??

Best n/a mph sbc 6.40 or slower no throttle stop car at 3250 lbs on the planet. Out of the box Brodix Track 1 heads. Re-used 17031 Fel-Pro head gaskets

I didn't re-use because I was broke, or for any other reason than I looked at the gaskets, and knew they'd work as good as new - Experience.

What now?

So, just to add some fuel to the fire. Did my reuse of a set of Rod bearings after 500 runs get your dander up? Do you think I checked them to a new one?

quote:

Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
Here is a question. Why has everyone gone to MLS? Where the composite gaskets giving you a problem? If you are running boost then I get it but just curious.

Curtis

P.S. as an OEM manufacturer I can tell you that I won't tell someone to re-use something that if they do it wrong will come back on me.

We started using them because at the time we had a need for a thinner gasket but with a 4.200 bore. For our type of engine, and with double the price of felpro composite, we didn't really see any advantage to using them. We went back to felpro composites once we didn't have a need for a thinner gasket.

Scott

quote:

Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
Here is a question. Why has everyone gone to MLS? Where the composite gaskets giving you a problem? If you are running boost then I get it but just curious.

Curtis

P.S. as an OEM manufacturer I can tell you that I won't tell someone to re-use something that if they do it wrong will come back on me.

We had a Fel Pro fail several years back. Non boosted application. #6 leaked into the lifter valley, luckily no head or block damage. After that everything got Cometics when it was time for a freshen up.

Interesting. I can see in special cases such as has been listed here. Otherwise I believe it’s because so and so does it so it must be better. I am not calling anyone out I just mean at the beginning and then it becomes common.

I have seen guys using them and they have no business doing it. They wouldn’t know a 8ra finish from a 120, nor where to find a profilometer to find out and then wonder why they leak.

Now if you buy your stuff then you get what you get and if that is what they use so be it. Thanks for the honest answers guys.

quote:

Originally posted by adv ET 266:
So, just to add some fuel to the fire. Did my reuse of a set of Rod bearings after 500 runs get your dander up? Do you think I checked them to a new one?

Yea well I wouldn't do that either. If it's apart why not new bearings. Even if you checked them not replacing makes no sense to me.

quote:

quote:
Originally posted by adv ET 266:
So, just to add some fuel to the fire. Did my reuse of a set of Rod bearings after 500 runs get your dander up? Do you think I checked them to a new one?
Yea well I wouldn't do that either. If it's apart why not new bearings. Even if you checked them not replacing makes no sense to me.

me either,that is a wear part,gaskets are not ,per say.

i cant find my,what did you call that thing curtis.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/SGesDMscYMivckyH9
I replaced the coated main bearings.

No Visible or measurable ware on 7 journals bearings. Shape identical to new. Many still had my original dial bore gauge pin mark. Zero technical reason to replace.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: adv ET 266,

New isn't necessarily better, for example if I had a record setting Super Stocker that hurt a ring. The repair would be on the ring, not to disturb the existing performance. Everything else would be put back together exactly as it was, regardless the service life.

If it ain't broke don't fix it. If you say I'm gonna change rings and bearings every X amount of runs, that would make it more of a ritual, than anything.

There's an acceptable tolerance you've developed through experience, for any given fastener or item, when assembling an engine.

I've seen people who take a ritual approach, but it isn't mine.

quote:

Originally posted by rusty:
i cant find my,what did you call that thing curtis.

LOL Rusty do you have your decks faced or ground? Also what is the ra called for to use mls gaskets? I much prefer having the decks of my block ground even though I don’t use mls gaskets.

What would be the tipping point on a na engine to go to mls? 183n had one fail but was it the gasket itself or something else?

quote:

Originally posted by rusty:
i cant find my,what did you call that thing curtis.


LOL Rusty do you have your decks faced or ground? Also what is the ra called for to use mls gaskets? I much prefer having the decks of my block ground even though I don’t use mls gaskets.

What would be the tipping point on a na engine to go to mls? 183n had one fail but was it the gasket itself or something else?


____________________________
2017 and 2018 Osage Casinos Tulsa Raceway Park No-Box Champion

curtis you were correct in your earlier statement,i dont know the finish.i tell my machanist what gaskets in the earlier days and leave it to them.for many years i have run higher compression (na) and used copper.when the mls came out i used the monkey see plan and jumped on the band wagon.my engines now are machined and i use copper.for me the tipping would be 15 plus compression,mls would be a good idea

also i have reused gaskets more than once.i am not recommending just trying to answer the op's question.if a deck on the head or block is not flat smooth ect even a new gasket will fail.
et 266 if i could see mich marks in the bearing,i understand your decision.

quote:

Originally posted by rusty:

quote:

quote:
Originally posted by adv ET 266:
So, just to add some fuel to the fire. Did my reuse of a set of Rod bearings after 500 runs get your dander up? Do you think I checked them to a new one?
Yea well I wouldn't do that either. If it's apart why not new bearings. Even if you checked them not replacing makes no sense to me.

me either,that is a wear part,gaskets are not ,per say.

A bearing shouldn't be a wear part. IMO, if the bearing doesn't look new, figure out why.