What if she fainted? What if she suffered a concussion?

If you're brain makes it through the liquid that surrounds it, insulating it from touching the skull, that's a concussion.

A guy I built a car for described the phenomenon by experiencing it on his first pass ever in the car... "it was like a black curtain came down for a second, then lifted"

He was knocked out. Some people get knocked out easy.

What if she suffered an injury - concussion?

I ain't saying shyt.

she might have gotten her bell rung, something ain't right about this.

It ain't adding up.

quote:

Originally posted by B KING:
We all have decisions/choices to make when we decide to compete at the dragstrip. Two competitors overdrove their race vehicles; John even admitted to it (maybe Geneva did also) & caused severe crashes. Glad no one was hurt!

How many others at Pomona overdrove their race vehicles but didn't cause crashes.

Overdriving happens at all levels/classes of drag racing in: time runs, qualifications, testing & eliminations.

Again... we all have decisions/choices to make at the track. It's not just your competitor, overdriving, breakage or a medical issues to name a few!

2BKING

No idea where you're going with this post!

This was a black and white case where from the release of the T-brake it wasn't good and just getting worse and worse the ****her she drove it down track. At the 330' it was 95% over, at the 660's it was 110% over!

I think Bender was correct, she panicked after she realized she was in trouble and just compounded the problem.

So, the real issue here, and it's been a problem for some time now, is the high HP available these days to the sportsman racers and those that have the funds to purchase a fast car an get in and race with little to no experience driving a fast car. We have seen it over and over, someone over driving a fast car and crashing. When is NHRA going to step up and address this problem! They are clearly passing out licenses to drivers not capable and not addressing it after multiple crashes from the same drivers! Talk about a lawsuit waiting to happen!

quote:

So, the real issue here, and it's been a problem for some time now, is the high HP available these days to the sportsman racers and those that have the funds to purchase a fast car an get in and race with little to no experience driving a fast car. We have seen it over and over, someone over driving a fast car and crashing. When is NHRA going to step up and address this problem! They are clearly passing out licenses to drivers not capable and not addressing it after multiple crashes from the same drivers! Talk about a lawsuit waiting to happen!

Good question. However this doesn't really apply to this situation. Geneva has been driving fast dragsters for over 35 years (That I'm aware of).

Its a sad deal for sure, both drivers are are getting towards the end of their racing days, and probably don't have the funds to rebuild. (possibly last weekend was it).

We all will that time that we need to slow down, hopefully we will all acknowledge it when the time comes.

Her demonstration of poor decision making, lack of judgement and inability to do something as simple as lift her foot off the gas pedal is a clear indication her racing days should be declared over if not by her, by the NHRA.

She was either incapacitated mentally or physically or her throttle stuck.....or ??? WTH ??

As an older driver that raced right up until less than 2 years ago and have driven a moderately fast dragster......I would probably not be driving a mid or low 6 second powered car

Sure, some seat time and making some laps and I'd be comfortable but you gotta respect that power and as Al said there are way to many people driving fast cars and many are way up there in age...

One reason I stayed mostly in S/C was the t-stop time made runs a h-e-l-l of a lot tamer and easier on the brains !! LOL

I'm sure this lady feels wicked bad but damn she was lucky !

What can be done to improve safety? Required
air launched chutes with a button on the wheel?How about safety crew down track that can kill the engine like you see in monster trucks or a system that kills the motor and deploy chutes?

The only one who can say what was going on inside her car at the time is her.

As far as age, My car got loose at the top end the week before in PHX I lifted to avoid hitting the top end cones. I will be 64 in a few weeks and my car went 6.06 at 233 Q3 in Pomona, is that to fast for my age?

The very sad results from this race would make a great advertisement for Laris on track insurance....

quote:

Originally posted by Moderate Joe:
What can be done to improve safety? Required
air launched chutes with a button on the wheel?How about safety crew down track that can kill the engine like you see in monster trucks or a system that kills the motor and deploy chutes?

Really!!!

How about take another look at the advanced licensing! First there are too many racers with the funds to purchase a fast car and make some easier runs and acquire a license with little to no prior racing experience! This is an accident waiting to happen, mainly because these drivers just don't know when it's time to lift due to lack of seat time. You just can't jump in a low 6 second car with a dozen or so runs under your belt and do it safely. Ya it's all good till it's not. Time to start limiting speeds and ET's based on experience, similar to Jr dragsters for kids. Then they need to address the racers with multiple crashes in a short period of time and remove them from competition until they prove they car race safely/meaning that they can and WILL make smart decisions, and also limit their ET/MPH during this time. Most of this is common sense!

quote:

Originally posted by TOP38:

quote:

Originally posted by B KING:
We all have decisions/choices to make when we decide to compete at the dragstrip. Two competitors overdrove their race vehicles; John even admitted to it (maybe Geneva did also) & caused severe crashes. Glad no one was hurt!

How many others at Pomona overdrove their race vehicles but didn't cause crashes.

Overdriving happens at all levels/classes of drag racing in: time runs, qualifications, testing & eliminations.

Again... we all have decisions/choices to make at the track. It's not just your competitor, overdriving, breakage or a medical issues to name a few!

2BKING

No idea where you're going with this post!

This was a black and white case where from the release of the T-brake it wasn't good and just getting worse and worse the ****her she drove it down track. At the 330' it was 95% over, at the 660's it was 110% over!

I think Bender was correct, she panicked after she realized she was in trouble and just compounded the problem.

So, the real issue here, and it's been a problem for some time now, is the high HP available these days to the sportsman racers and those that have the funds to purchase a fast car an get in and race with little to no experience driving a fast car. We have seen it over and over, someone over driving a fast car and crashing. When is NHRA going to step up and address this problem! They are clearly passing out licenses to drivers not capable and not addressing it after multiple crashes from the same drivers! Talk about a lawsuit waiting to happen!

You & others have it all figured out on what happened. The point is nothing will change the outcome of them crashes with opinions. Now, the last few posts have started talking about some possible fixes. Then you have to get someone to take action on it.

So, until then; we all have a decision/choice to make when making a pass. Is your competitor a Wanna-Be John Force or Geneva that has plenty of experience. Or is your competitor a newly licensed or even un-licensed, non-experienced driver. You are rolling the dice on what you get regardless.

2BKING

This message has been edited. Last edited by: B KING,

Although you may know what to do in this situation if it happens to you, are you going to do it? When the brain goes into "oh s#!t" mode, what you know to do is not always what happens. I hope none of you have to find out first hand how you would react if you were in that seat.

I know Geneva from my days being apart of NorCal Top Comp and as Mark stated, she has been doing this for years.

I think we can eliminate the experience factor in these crashes.
One thing to remember about racing, is that these cars are driven by imperfect humans. Even a fantastic instinctual driver can make the wrong call or move. It happens, and sometimes when it happens it bites us or others.
Now the age thing is a whole different rabbit hole to go down. Imperfect humans get more perfect with experience, and then eventually less perfect with age. It happens to everyone differently and at different rates. Sometimes it's hard to know when it is time to hang up the keys. I don't think strangers can make that call. Did it have anything to do with these incidents? Impossible for any of us keyboard warriors to say.

quote:

Originally posted by Bucky:
I think we can eliminate the experience factor in these crashes.
One thing to remember about racing, is that these cars are driven by imperfect humans. Even a fantastic instinctual driver can make the wrong call or move. It happens, and sometimes when it happens it bites us or others.
Now the age thing is a whole different rabbit hole to go down. Imperfect humans get more perfect with experience, and then eventually less perfect with age. It happens to everyone differently and at different rates. Sometimes it's hard to know when it is time to hang up the keys. I don't think strangers can make that call. Did it have anything to do with these incidents? Impossible for any of us keyboard warriors to say.

Magic drivers and now "fantastic instinctual drivers" hmmmm?

Are you talking about yourself again idiot?

STFU.

Go blow a track official between rounds in exchange for some freedom, commie.

Unlike dirt car drivers the fact that our cars rarely get in big trouble most drivers don't know how they will react when they are really in trouble. Those guys wreck enough to actually practice what to do. Most of us have had a car on the edge but very few have had one really out of control and especially with the power of a car such as Geneva's.

I hope that most have a plan and even practice it sometimes. I kill my power every time I get out of the car so reaching for the kill switch has been a natural practiced movement for me. I have had to get used to it in a different position since I put it on my steering wheel though. Muscle memory works because I am still reaching for where the cable handle used to be but it's only been one race.

I don't run a parachute but for those who do if you don't pull it occasionally could you even find it in a hurry? No matter any of our opinions I hate to see someone's stuff get torn up.

Force come up there with not enough down force, hail mary, swing'n for the fences from the bottom of the ladder, and ended up on a bull that slammed him into the wall.

This chic in the dragster probably got her bell rung. If she wasn't unconscious, she drove like she was.

quote:

Originally posted by Moderate Joe:
What can be done to improve safety? Required
air launched chutes with a button on the wheel?How about safety crew down track that can kill the engine like you see in monster trucks or a system that kills the motor and deploy chutes?

Not sure if you`re aware of it but 2 of the NPK guys came up with an electronic devise that a crew member releases the trans brake from outside of the car for the driver. In my opinion, it`s stupid because what if the crew member is brain dead and cant cut a light but why not come up with something similar that shuts the car down by a crew member. I can see an argument between the driver and his crew but someone has to have common sense. It`s simple, you see the car start to get out of shape, drift towards the center line or wall, you shut it down.

What can be done?

Accidents happen, it is what it is.

Accidents are not planned like backroom deals in the tower.

You can do something about backroom deals in the tower.

You can't accidents, it is what it is.

Deliberate

You guys keep talking about how long she's been driving as if it's an automatic qualification. I've seen talented young kids jump in a car (or pick up any other skill) and be a natural at it. Then there's people who have been doing something 30+ years and still suck at it. Every sport or activity is going to have people whose wallet is bigger than their skillset.

If she has 30 years experience it must have been in juniors because she was F*CKED as soon as she staged.
She was staged/pointed toward the center line (Mistake 1), then she stayed in it WAY to long crossing the center line (mistake 2), she was still on the throttle crossing the center line (mistake 3), she still had it floored when she was in the OTHER lane (mistake 4 -- see picture from Tom, frames 1 and 2) she then lifted (frames 3 and 4), she then floored it again (mistake 5 -- frames 5, 6 and 7).
You can see the butterflies as plain as day (RED).
Not to mention, she was out of the car pretty fast for someone knocked out.

Fact is: She was NOT knocked out NOR was there a hung throttle.

Just because she's been racing a long time MEANS NOTHING.

Glad everyone is OK.
It could have been a lot worse if she T-boned him in the cage.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: pentastarrail,

quote:

Originally posted by BD104X:
You guys keep talking about how long she's been driving as if it's an automatic qualification. I've seen talented young kids jump in a car (or pick up any other skill) and be a natural at it. Then there's people who have been doing something 30+ years and still suck at it. Every sport or activity is going to have people whose wallet is bigger than their skillset.

This has a lot to do with it. Some people are naturally better at it. Some can learn through experience and some just do not have it.

Most crashes I have seen on Friday night test and tune /street type races at the track are from getting loose and getting right back in it. Operator malfunction.

Now it appeared that Geneva never even got out of it. Assuming that her throttle did not stick then I would say it to is operator malfunction. Even if the throttle did stick it is the driver responsibility to make sure car is safe and throttle does not stick.
It is driver responsibility to have a plan if throttle does stick, if there is a fire, if brakes fail.

I have helped a lot of people learn to drive and one of first things I tell them is if throttle ever sticks then you better be prepared and act immediately. Then I also tell them to use multiple return springs and check close that nothing binds or sticks.
Kill ignition, fuel, throw out parachute and if it does not stop put car in neutral and hope the rev limiter catches it. Even if it does not easier to replace a motor than a car and driver and funerals are expensive now. Not only that you better be prepared to do it at night with possibly oil and fire on you. Make a plan and be prepared before any thing happens. Practice that plan so you do not have to even think about it if it ever happens.

There was a lot going on there but it appeared that she was mathematically eliminated before crash ever happened so she should have just eased out of it and ran another day.