quote:

Originally posted by 329L:
Side benefit is it is faster with dual springs than triples. But to each their own.

While I agree very few if any bracket combinations need triple springs and many are over sprung, I would love to see data with only a spring change from triples to duals showing more MPH.

.02 and 2 mph. Went from 280 800 to 350 1050

The new valve springs are far superior to what we had just 10 years ago. They last a long time, do not break like they used to and are able to control the valve at close to coil bind.
Yes they are a little more expensive but it is money well spent.
As for heat sink I do not like to rev the motor until I have put some heat in the motor. That is not just for valve springs but for the whole motor. The pistons, rings etc expand some as they heat and you want those up to proper operating temp first for proper sealing and lubrication.

His very first post should have indicated valve spring issue...He have .750 max lift springs and .765 Lift cam....So he is correct to think he needs different springs....And be thankful it didn't drop a valve..

1. "max lift" is just a manufacturer's guideline

2. his cam has .765 gross lift less lash.

3. Spring height has to be set and coil bind checked always!

Further, in addition to these FACTS previously stated...

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
I ran Manley’s Nextek polished dual spring #221443P on my 700+HP 468 built by our own SCDIV1 for many years and thousands of 1/4 mile passes, whose specs are….

1.580 diameter
250psi closed
610psi open
.730 max lift

With my LSM cam

254/260 @ .050
.740/.740 gross lift
107LSA

I've been running Manley’s Nextek polished dual spring #221424P on my 900+HP 522 built by Sunset Racecraft for many years and thousands of 1/4 mile passes, whose specs are….

1.640 diameter
250psi closed
800psi open
.850 max lift

With my Comp cam

272/286 @ .050
.860/.840 gross lift
109LSA

and turning 8100 in the lights.

the cam in my new 648 built by PAR has .947 lift and the specs of PSI dual polished springs #1254RML are...

1.520″ diameter
350psi closed
1040psi open
.900″ max lift


So Novacaine you "think" you don't want my advice but I KNOW you NEED my advice because clearly you ain't been listening to the right people!

quote:

Originally posted by 329L:
.02 and 2 mph. Went from 280 800 to 350 1050

Can I assume you have the from and to numbers backwards or did you add pressure?

Why would you assume that? I read it as he went from a triple spring that was 280 on the seat and 800 open to a dual spring that is 350 and 1050 which resulted in .02 quicker and 2 mph faster.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 1320racer,

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Why would you assume that? I read it as he went from a triple spring that was 280 on the seat and 800 open to a dual spring that is 350 and 1050 which resulted in .02 quicker and 2 mph faster.

The Dual springs were the lower pressure spring. Kinda thought that would be assumed. Also, i went from dual, to tripple, back to dual in the matter of weeks.

As stated, the springs on my 648 are duals, no need for triples

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Why would you assume that? I read it as he went from a triple spring that was 280 on the seat and 800 open to a dual spring that is 350 and 1050 which resulted in .02 quicker and 2 mph faster.

Because of this reply.

quote:

Originally posted by 329L:
I rememeber when i thought astronomical spring pressures were needed to keep a valve closed. Then i got educated.

quote:

Originally posted by 329L:
.02 and 2 mph. Went from 280 800 to 350 1050

Thats interesting, I wonder if that would apply to a boosted engine with the exh valve opening against the boost and the intake having boost on the back of the valve while closed. I run a PAC 1358 triple with only 825int/799exh lift and 30lbs of boost. I check them all the time and they are always 350-370 on the seat. I replaced them at 150 runs just cause I felt guilty. They are working great for me and I have always believed don't fix what ain't broke.

Specs on the 1358
Part Type: PAC Roller Valve Springs
Style: 1300 Drag Race Series
Type: Triple
Damper Included: Yes
Outer Spring Out Side Diameter (O.D.): 1.645"
Outer Spring In Side Diameter (I.D.): 1.195"
Inner Spring Out Side Diameter (O.D.): NA
Inner Spring In Side Diameter (I.D.): .635"
Seat Pressure: 350 @ 2.150"
Open Pressure: 1004 @ 1.200"
Valve Spring Rate: 688
Maximum Suggested Lift: .950"
Coil Bind: 1.130"

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Big Steve,

Lots of apples and oranges comparisons in this thread.

The best person to recommend valve springs for any given cam, is the cam grinder, second is the guy who had the cam ground. That's Straub, he has made his recommendation.

I run this or that valve spring, so you should too, never works.

Velocity's in play at the valve, determine the combination of components chosen, not valve lift alone.

It's silly for anyone to believe they can read 90% of the posts in this thread, and learn anything.

The only thing I found interesting about this thread, is Bad News tech which says the damper on a Isky Tool Room spring gouges titanium retainers, because now I'll be watching for it.

quote:

Originally posted by Big Steve:
I have always believed don't fix what ain't broke.

No truer words have been spoken no mind as it relates to what we do YET some like the OP, “thinks” they should be running quicker with nothing to back up their thoughts except their own disappointment and like minded opinions from a few on these forums that know little if anything about the car/combo and the driver’s knowledge.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 1320racer,

Boosted application spinning 8500-9000 rpm's at the stripe, 400 on the seat, 1100 open, 1" lift cam, 23 sbc.

Velocity at the valve determines components chosen.

If the only experience ya got is what someone else bolted on the crate engine you ordered over the phone, it shouldn't be taken as tech by anyone following along.

Apples and oranges

I ordered the spring equivalent to What the cam manufacturer recommended me to get. He said Pac 1224 and I got a howard spring that matches it. Im not trying to go faster or anything. Just want to have everything working togather for optimum power and et. I dont need to go real fast like people and I build all my engines . I have the machine shop do all block and head work. I dont buy mine over the phone. I bracket race for fun as a hobby. Never claimed to know it all . I do appreciate all the good info and help. And especially to the ones that didnt bash my stuff or me. I have my ideas and thats why I THINK alot and stat that in my replys...

quote:

Originally posted by Novacaine:
I dont buy mine over the phone.

You should because you clearly don’t know what your doing and following the advice of the wrong people! Meanwhile myself and the vast majority of serious bracket racers and class racers including million dollar race winners, divisional and world champions have PROFESSIONALS build our race engines, professionals whose phones are constantly ringing from racers that want them to either freshen their engine or build them a new combo Because of their reputations born on the track with proven reliable performance round after round resulting in countless wins and championships! Besides if you can’t afford $900 to assemble your engine, you’ve got no business staging your car.

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:

quote:

Originally posted by Novacaine:
I dont buy mine over the phone.

You should because you clearly don’t know what your doing and following the advice of the wrong people! Meanwhile myself and the vast majority of serious bracket racers and class racers including million dollar race winners, divisional and world champions have PROFESSIONALS build our race engines, professionals whose phones are constantly ringing from racers that want them to either freshen their engine or build them a new combo Because of their reputations born on the track with proven reliable performance round after round resulting in countless wins and championships! Besides if you can’t afford $900 to assemble your engine, you’ve got no business staging your car.

I dont see any championships under your make believe resume. Do me a favor, Go !@#$ yourself you dumb *****.

And by the way how was that race in Lebanon dragway.. wasnt to good was it??? I guess all your experience didnt pay off there did it???

You don’t want to spar with me pal, you’ll lose!

You’re a clueless nit wit! Oh and our resume includes 2 wins over the last 5 weeks in 2 different cats totaling $7000

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
You don’t want to spare with me pal, you’ll lose!

You’re a clueless not wit! Oh and out resume includes 2 wins over the last 5 weeks in 2 different cats totaling $7000

I call that BS