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DRR S/Pro |
Will 1 fit? J.R. Baxter ""Fathom the hypocrisy of a Government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured ..but not everyone must prove they are a citizen." 2024 Miller Rolla Competition Engines ProCharger Hoosier Tires Abruzzi | |||
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DRR Elite |
Yes but I'm told by all including Go Lithium that I need two. | |||
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DRR S/Pro |
Ed Are you running the Ford type solenoids because your car has the battery cable to the starter run through the frame? I never liked the idea of running the battery cable through the frame (positive one). I don't run one on my car, just the stock type one on the starter. Every connection and switch including a solenoid adds resistance. The other thing most don't get is the understanding of the circuit, meaning the complete path from and back to the battery counts equally. Where 16v systems have an added advantage is they see less voltage loss due to higher volts. Power is volts x amps, so to get the same power (what's required to turn the starter motor) for a given length of wire, the more amps it carries the more voltage loss that occurs. The lower the supply voltage is the higher the amps need to be to get the require power. So a 16v deal needs about 70% of the amps a 12v deal needs which adds up to less voltage drop. 16 feet or just copper wire carrying 550 amps 1/0 wire - 1.73 volts lost (1.26 at 400 amps and 16 volts) 1 wire = 2.18 volts lost (1.6) 2 wire = 2.75 volts lost (2.0) This is just the cable alone, add for losses for switches, connections etc. | |||
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DRR Elite |
Yes, that's how it was wired from Undercover and that's how Bill Frederick aka Elite Chassis continues to wire all his cars. Now with both cables on the same side of the solenoid, it's always hot when the power is on. | |||
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DRR Elite |
Why would higher voltage result in lower amperage? If the starter turns faster, it's doing more work correct? If we were measuring flow through a pipe, higher pressure would not result in less flow. The same sized pipe (resistance) would flow more (current) with higher pressure (voltage). Foxtrot Juliet Bravo | |||
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DRR S/Pro |
All electric motors that are free spinning, no load, draw the least amount of power/amps are spinning at max rpm. Apply load/resistance and rpm drops and amp draw increases along with heat build up. Just like an engine on a dyno! Work which in this case is power produced to turn the motor over cannot be produced until load is applied, no load no work. Work requires load to be performed in a given amount of time, just like HP which really means ft-lbs/second. So for electric motors, Work/power = volts x AMPS, If you hold power to a constant and increase volts, AMPS goes down. For our starters, the work required to turn a motor over at a fixed rpm is constant. And yes, when you swap a 12v battery with a 16v battery the motor spins over faster because more work is occurring. | |||
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DRR Elite |
That's what I'm getting at. More work is being done. So did the amps/current actually get reduced? Foxtrot Juliet Bravo | |||
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DRR S/Pro |
If the starter spins faster/more rpms, then yes, less amps/current flow is occurring. | |||
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DRR Sportsman |
Simple answer: Ohm's Law Dan DOES YOUR IDEOLOGY ALLOW YOU TO EQUITABLY APPLY STANDARDS OF ACCOUNTABILITY OR DOES IT PROMOTE THE PRACTICE OF HYPOCRISY? | |||
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DRR Elite |
Again, that only applies if the work is held constant. If the starter spins the engine over faster, that isn't the case is it?This message has been edited. Last edited by: Bucky, Foxtrot Juliet Bravo | |||
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DRR Sportsman |
Higher voltage applied results in Lower Ohmic Resistance. Lower ohmic resistance results in lower amperage draw. This applies to electrical part of the starting circuit. Gear reduction drive components lower the mechanical resistance of the rotating engine. This applies to the mechanical part of the starting system. Both higher voltage applied AND lower rotational resistance can be helpful in reducing "work" needed to start an engine... Dan DOES YOUR IDEOLOGY ALLOW YOU TO EQUITABLY APPLY STANDARDS OF ACCOUNTABILITY OR DOES IT PROMOTE THE PRACTICE OF HYPOCRISY? | |||
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DRR Elite |
Why are we now bringing all sorts of other variables into it? I simply pointed out that you aren't looking at apples to apples when the starter is turning faster with the higher voltage. If you increase the voltage in an electric car and it travels faster, you don't hold the work done on both sides of the equation as equal do you? Foxtrot Juliet Bravo | |||
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DRR Top Comp |
Ed, I’m assuming that the oil pan you’re running will not allow you to run a 153 tooth flexplate? Clowns to the left of me, Jokers to the right. Here I am....... | |||
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DRR Sportsman |
All I can say is, "I'm sorry you don't understand Ohm's law and how it applies to the basic operation of any and all electrical systems"... Dan DOES YOUR IDEOLOGY ALLOW YOU TO EQUITABLY APPLY STANDARDS OF ACCOUNTABILITY OR DOES IT PROMOTE THE PRACTICE OF HYPOCRISY? | |||
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DRR Elite |
Is the preference of the 153 over the 168? And because That ratio would turn the engine faster? Foxtrot Juliet Bravo | |||
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DRR S/Pro |
Sorry Dan but the distance of the starter motor stays the same, it is fixed and technically the higher applied voltage will increase amperage draw. A starter will draw high amps with a battery that is dead because the motor is being stalled. If you increase the applied voltage to a dc motor the amp draw will increase at the same rate, example go from 12 volt to 16 volt is a 25% increase in voltage so amps will increase by 25%. | |||
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DRR Top Comp |
Bucky, Yes, that is exactly why. My cars have always started great all these years and my contention is that’s the reason. If I build a new bigger, higher horsepower engine down the road it will probably need the larger flexplate because of the oil pan design. Clowns to the left of me, Jokers to the right. Here I am....... | |||
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DRR Elite |
I know all my mini starters have two mounting locations. Is there a diameter difference between some of the flywheels? Foxtrot Juliet Bravo | |||
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DRR Top Comp |
Yes, the 153 tooth SBC flywheel is smaller. It's pretty much all I've ever run on my Big Blocks. Works like a champ. Some bigger kicked out oil pans will not allow it though. Clowns to the left of me, Jokers to the right. Here I am....... | |||
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