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Alternators..again
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DRR Trophy
posted
I’ve got an el cheapo 10si 1 wire chrome alt on my junk now, supposed to be 100 amps but I believe it’s about bit the dust. Didn’t put out what I needed at idle anyway.
I’ve got an ICT billet mount on an Aerospace water pump, need something that’ll fit the mount I have. Right now, with electric water pump, electric fan, bg400, delay box, tbrake, grid ignition, etc. voltage drops to 12.8-13.0, and stays at 13.2 going down the track. I’d like to have 80-100 amps at idle or whatever rpm I’m coming down the return road. Just replaced the battery (Interstate) with an Optima red top yesterday. Would be nice to double enter and make 2 or 3 passes without charging.
Is there something like a factory cs130/12si/etc application that’ll work? Or just bite the bullet and drop $$$$ on something aftermarket?
Like a lot of racers, I have a bunch of crap to upgrade and fix over the off-season and I’m not rich or sponsored up by no means.
What’s the hot setup?
 
Posts: 97 | Location: South MS | Registered: September 07, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of Hotrod Corvette
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https://store.alternatorparts....ty-alternator-1.aspx

You will never regret this all new unit

Upgrade to the Larger CS144 Series Alternator
The CS-144 produces more power at idle and is much more reliable. For custom applications we can install many different pulley types, like single & dual V-Belt, 8-Groove serpentine, etc.

CS144 Series Single Bridge Rectifier Alternators
100% NEW, NO CORE CHARGE
Delco Remy Type CS144 Series Single Bridge Rectifier High Output Alternator and Standard Output Alternators with either Standard type plug-in or Self Exciting (one wire) version

Single Bridge Rectifier CS144 Alternators can be used to either replace a broken stock units or upgrade from smaller alternators that give less output at idle and are less reliable. The CS-144 can replace the CS130, 10Si, 12Si, 15,Si, 17Si. Some slight modifications may be required and you may need a wiring harness adapter, call to check on your vehicle

Delco Remy type CS144 series late style heavy duty single rectifier alternator . Includes one bridge rectifier and a standard 14.7V set point voltage regulator. Available in 140, 170 and 200 amp variations.


Burt

I'm So Proud To Be An American And Not A Democrat...

 
Posts: 1217 | Location: Clinton Township, MI | Registered: September 16, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of banjo
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Couple question about your current setup,

What is your pulley ratio?

How long is the alternator wire, and what size?

I suspect you have some wiring issues. Look into voltage drop testing, it will help you identify where your issues are.

voltage drop testing

With that said, I run a autozone cs130,I think it was about 100 bucks, rated at a 105 amps, and it has a lifetime warranty. I run it with a 2-1 pulley ratio. I choose this alternator because it will put out around 50 amps at 2000 alternator rpms. So with a 2-1 ratio, it puts out 50 amps at idle. I have a 4 gauge wire run from the alternator to the battery in the rear. With everything turned on, it will show 14.2 volts at idle. I have had it on my car for the last 4-5 years with no issues.


Bill Simpkins
74 Nova
SBC 406
3240 pounds
Speierracing heads

60 1.27 (10/16)
1/8 6.03@111 (10/16)
Best 9.87@131 on the rev limitor 1 Feb 2013


nova

quarterpanelview

wheelie

FTI Converter
www.speierracingheads.com

 
Posts: 1829 | Location: San Angelo | Registered: March 07, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by banjo:
Couple question about your current setup,

What is your pulley ratio?

How long is the alternator wire, and what size?

I suspect you have some wiring issues. Look into voltage drop testing, it will help you identify where your issues are.

voltage drop testing

With that said, I run a autozone cs130,I think it was about 100 bucks, rated at a 105 amps, and it has a lifetime warranty. I run it with a 2-1 pulley ratio. I choose this alternator because it will put out around 50 amps at 2000 alternator rpms. So with a 2-1 ratio, it puts out 50 amps at idle. I have a 4 gauge wire run from the alternator to the battery in the rear. With everything turned on, it will show 14.2 volts at idle. I have had it on my car for the last 4-5 years with no issues.


Wire goes back to the battery in the trunk, 4 gauge wire. I’ll have to check the pulley ratio tomorrow. Need to do a voltage drop test, will try to do that tomorrow also.
 
Posts: 97 | Location: South MS | Registered: September 07, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
Picture of NC3x58
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I'm no alternator expert, but give Mark Payne a call... A lot of members here run his alternators and when I initially called him about getting one for my dragster, he was very easy to work with and got me hooked up. If nothing else he may be able to answer some questions for you.


Nick Craig

1971 Camaro Split Bumper
376ci LS3
 
Posts: 410 | Location: Ohio | Registered: December 28, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
Picture of Black&Blue
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X 2 on the cs144. They are a little larger and heavier than the si10, but they have great output at idle. I ran 140amp si12 a while ago, switched to a 140 amp cs130. They are nothing compared to the stock 140 amp cs144 I recently switched to
 
Posts: 6 | Location: Bloomsburg | Registered: January 31, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
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I have the same deal Banjo has---never been a problem except once years ago and they replaced it FREE!
 
Posts: 6188 | Location: everywhere | Registered: March 15, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Sportsman
Picture of TD3550
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80- 100 at idle is a ton. Whats the cable run length and size right now?. Alt amperage output is an on demand situation only Componet. One and or combined. On average #2 AWG-#6 AWG is going to be required pending on run length. 13.2-13.4 is about normal on voltage. You get up near 15.8 or above on a 12 system,things go wrong. Like cook the battery. Seen too many cars in 40 years with under rated cable size.

Drag racing = 1.75:1 ratio average on the pulley combo size. Just some pointers.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: TD3550,
 
Posts: 1406 | Location: Under a Truck | Registered: August 23, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of banjo
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Where are you reading the voltage from?

With a 1 wire alternator, the alt is regulating the voltage based on what it see at the alternator. With the long runs of wire and multiple connections, seeing 1 volt of drop across that may be expected.

I like the 3 wire setup with the long runs of wires because it allows you to place the sense wire where you want the alternator to regulate to. I have mine on my main distribution point.

The 144 imo is way overkill. I dont think your load will be more than 50-60 amps with everything turned on.

I log amps going down the track. I typically see between 25-40 amps depending on the state of charge.

Also keep in mind, the alternator will only put out what it is loaded to. So if the load is 40 amps, it only puts out 40 amps. Basically the way it works, is that the alternator tries to maintain a certain voltage at a set point. With a one wire, this is at the alternator, with a 3 wire, its were the sense wire is. So basically when you turn something on, this puts additional load on the circuit, and pulls the voltage down. The alternator sees this and increases the output to get the voltage back to the setpoint.

Another thing, it's better to oversize the alternator, then to undersize. The closer you get to max output of the alternator, the less efficient it becomes. I try to choose an alternator that is capable of meeting the max load at idle. If you arent seeing 14 volts at idle, the alternator is charging going down the track, which I have seen cause consistancy issues. I have mine set up where I can turn everything on at idle and see no less than 14 volts.


Bill Simpkins
74 Nova
SBC 406
3240 pounds
Speierracing heads

60 1.27 (10/16)
1/8 6.03@111 (10/16)
Best 9.87@131 on the rev limitor 1 Feb 2013


nova

quarterpanelview

wheelie

FTI Converter
www.speierracingheads.com

 
Posts: 1829 | Location: San Angelo | Registered: March 07, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
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Wire goes straight from the alt to the battery, about 12-13’ #4 gauge wire.
I don’t have a good way to measure DC amps- I have several multimeters and clamps but they either read ac only or read dc in series, Max 10 amps..guess I could put the meter in series on each electrical device and try it that way?
I’ll check pulleys and such when I get home, if I don’t get blown away by a tornado on the way!
 
Posts: 97 | Location: South MS | Registered: September 07, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of banjo
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You dont have to necessary measure it,

Ignition your looking at 8-10 amps wot, 1-2 amps at idle
Water pump. 6-8 amp
Single fan, 15-20 amps
Bg 400. 15 Amps
Misc electric(delaybox gauges) 4-5 amps

I would estimate your looking at around 50 amps at idle.

Cs130 would work well for you. I can get the part number I use and wiring if you are interested.

I run a serpentine belt also

Another thing I found, the alternator mounting needs to be rock solid. If that mount you have uses to two long bolts with spaces connected to the water pump, it can flex left to right. On my car, it would eventually break the long bolts from working back and forth over time. I did away with those two longs bolts and made a bracket that eliminates the left and right movement.

It took me a while to figure out why I was breaking those bolts. I would tighten the belt it would come loose and slip. I can post pictures if you want to see how I remedied it.


Bill Simpkins
74 Nova
SBC 406
3240 pounds
Speierracing heads

60 1.27 (10/16)
1/8 6.03@111 (10/16)
Best 9.87@131 on the rev limitor 1 Feb 2013


nova

quarterpanelview

wheelie

FTI Converter
www.speierracingheads.com

 
Posts: 1829 | Location: San Angelo | Registered: March 07, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
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Banjo, I would like to see the pictures of the alternator mount if you don’t mind. Mine flexes and looking for ideas. Thanks.
 
Posts: 484 | Location: Going to or returning from the chipmine. | Registered: July 01, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of banjo
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I made a bracket that bolts direct to the waterpump as opposed to using the long bolts. I made the bracket out of cardboard at first to get the shape I wanted and took it to a metal shop and had them cut and bent it. Hopefully this will help, this will work for a csr waterpump, but you can see what you are trying to accomplish.




Bill Simpkins
74 Nova
SBC 406
3240 pounds
Speierracing heads

60 1.27 (10/16)
1/8 6.03@111 (10/16)
Best 9.87@131 on the rev limitor 1 Feb 2013


nova

quarterpanelview

wheelie

FTI Converter
www.speierracingheads.com

 
Posts: 1829 | Location: San Angelo | Registered: March 07, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Wooley:
I would like to see the pictures of the alternator mount. Mine flexes and looking for ideas.


Here’s my PowerMaster 47293 150 amp mount that uses 4 bolts and is rock solid. 2-1 pullys. This is with a Meziere pump.

 
Posts: 2424 | Location: 53056 | Registered: December 30, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Sportsman
Picture of TD3550
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Mine, at the RHS very bottom. Rack car..


 
Posts: 1406 | Location: Under a Truck | Registered: August 23, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of BarneyB
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House of Payne, Mark Payne is the guru on alternators



WiredTwoWin race car wiring



 
Posts: 2436 | Location: Wadsworth, Ohio | Registered: December 12, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
Picture of Curly1
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The alternator on my car is one of the good high dollar ones that cost about $300 and it worked good for about 4 years. Then it quit working so I took it to local alternator repair shop and they charged me around $50 to fix it. I asked them what is the difference between this one and the $100 dollar ones, his response was "Nothing, they are same, same housing, same components"

He fixed it and have not had any problems with it for another 4 years. Did go to 16 volt system late last year.


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Before you argue with someone ask yourself, "Is this person mentally mature enough to grasp the concept of a different perspective?" If not there is no point to argue.

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Posts: 3953 | Location: United States of Texas | Registered: April 02, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
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Banjo- what p/n cs130 do you use?
Pretty sure my mount don’t flex- of course it’s possible but when I took off the steel mid mount and went to the ICT billet mount it stopped throwing belts @ 7000 rpms. It would be pretty easy to fab up a reinforcement on the back.
Didn’t get to look at anything tonight, weather was kinda bad here. Hopefully tomorrow I can back it outta the trailer and do some checking.
 
Posts: 97 | Location: South MS | Registered: September 07, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of banjo
posted Hide Post
The alternator I run is off an 88 chevy caprice with the 5.0. Carb.
Auto zone part number is 1341-5-11
O'Reilly's part number is R111790A

Let me know if you have any further questions


Bill Simpkins
74 Nova
SBC 406
3240 pounds
Speierracing heads

60 1.27 (10/16)
1/8 6.03@111 (10/16)
Best 9.87@131 on the rev limitor 1 Feb 2013


nova

quarterpanelview

wheelie

FTI Converter
www.speierracingheads.com

 
Posts: 1829 | Location: San Angelo | Registered: March 07, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of Hotrod Corvette
posted Hide Post
quote:
The 144 imo is way overkill.

Another thing, it's better to oversize the alternator, then to undersize.


Bill so which one it is?

With the CS 144 the OP can leave the battery charger in the trailer...all day


Burt

I'm So Proud To Be An American And Not A Democrat...

 
Posts: 1217 | Location: Clinton Township, MI | Registered: September 16, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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