engine builders what rings are you using in todays bracket engines ? 565 , 1150 alky carb , JE pistons dome, Brodix BB2extra , roller , ect. gapless top /gapless second / conventional ? oh 1/16 1/16 3/16 ,thanks
December 09, 2020, 05:21 PM
imakehp
For a bracket engine, I'd use 1/16 top, 1/16 napier 2nd and a std tension oil ring...
. Dave
F J B
December 09, 2020, 05:49 PM
wideopen231
Not engine builder by trade,but have built a butt load of them. With blown alky and injected motors I have always had good luck with Total seal.Have run both gapless top and gapless second with equal results. If bracket engine I see no reason not to go 1/16 top and second and either std or low tension oil ring. You can gain a cpl hp maybe with fancy thinner rings but IMO for bracket you will never see the difference and going to cost you more than likely more cash.
Give total seal a call.It will not cost a dime to see what they recommend.
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December 09, 2020, 06:00 PM
Bad News
C-33 Napier 3/16, but medium or low tension. If you are using a vacuum pump the low tension will be fine.
December 10, 2020, 07:28 AM
329L
.043-.043-3mm with gas ports for over 10 years. Will make 300 runs with no problems. I also believe they seal better, for longer.
Jeremiah Hall
December 10, 2020, 10:03 AM
sr4440
Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.
JoeThis message has been edited. Last edited by: sr4440,
Without data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.
December 10, 2020, 10:11 AM
Mike Rietow
Gapless second, standard tension oil.
December 10, 2020, 11:03 AM
CURTIS REED
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440: Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.
Joe
Joe, what is the radial dimensions of the .9mm ring?
____________________________ 2017 and 2018 Osage Casinos Tulsa Raceway Park No-Box Champion
2018 Div4 Goodguys Hammer award winner
December 10, 2020, 12:23 PM
TOP38
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Rietow: Gapless second, standard tension oil.
So wrong it's not even funny
December 10, 2020, 12:25 PM
TOP38
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440: Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.
Joe
Used this ring packages for years now. Works great, only suggestion is to modify the oil rings from 11 to 21 lbs unless you use a dry sump! And you won't loose HP with this swap also!
BTW the second ring in a Napier ring.
December 10, 2020, 12:41 PM
CURTIS REED
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440: Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.
Joe
Used this ring packages for years now. Works great, only suggestion is to modify the oil rings from 11 to 21 lbs unless you use a dry sump! And you won't loose HP with this swap also!
BTW the second ring in a Napier ring.
How about a 16lb oil ring with the vacuum pump instead of the 21?
____________________________ 2017 and 2018 Osage Casinos Tulsa Raceway Park No-Box Champion
2018 Div4 Goodguys Hammer award winner
December 10, 2020, 01:23 PM
TOP38
quote:
Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440: Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.
Joe
Used this ring packages for years now. Works great, only suggestion is to modify the oil rings from 11 to 21 lbs unless you use a dry sump! And you won't loose HP with this swap also!
BTW the second ring in a Napier ring.
How about a 16lb oil ring with the vacuum pump instead of the 21?
I would say this, the larger the CID of the motor the more windage splash there is and therefore the need for more oil control! I run a 632 BBC in brackets and TD, I switch this past winter from the 11 to 21 or 23 lbs oil rings, you definitely feel the difference rotating the motor over by hand between the two rings but the car was faster this year by a small amount with no other changes. Oil is not good when it gets into the combustion chamber. Before I swapped I was also considering something in the middle too like you suggested but decided not to and I was glad I did.
I also run a vacuum pump..
December 10, 2020, 02:40 PM
CURTIS REED
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440: Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.
Joe
Used this ring packages for years now. Works great, only suggestion is to modify the oil rings from 11 to 21 lbs unless you use a dry sump! And you won't loose HP with this swap also!
BTW the second ring in a Napier ring.
How about a 16lb oil ring with the vacuum pump instead of the 21?
I would say this, the larger the CID of the motor the more windage splash there is and therefore the need for more oil control! I run a 632 BBC in brackets and TD, I switch this past winter from the 11 to 21 or 23 lbs oil rings, you definitely feel the difference rotating the motor over by hand between the two rings but the car was faster this year by a small amount with no other changes. Oil is not good when it gets into the combustion chamber. Before I swapped I was also considering something in the middle too like you suggested but decided not to and I was glad I did.
I also run a vacuum pump..
Real world experience that you have is why I asked. I can get away with 11lb rings in my baby engines.
____________________________ 2017 and 2018 Osage Casinos Tulsa Raceway Park No-Box Champion
2018 Div4 Goodguys Hammer award winner
December 10, 2020, 04:43 PM
Mike Rietow
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Rietow: Gapless second, standard tension oil.
So wrong it's not even funny
n/a I run dykes
December 10, 2020, 06:33 PM
sr4440
quote:
Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440: Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.
Joe
Joe, what is the radial dimensions of the .9mm ring?
Without data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.
December 10, 2020, 06:50 PM
CURTIS REED
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440:
quote:
Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440: Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.
Joe
Joe, what is the radial dimensions of the .9mm ring?