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DRR Trophy
posted
engine builders what rings are you using in todays bracket engines ? 565 , 1150 alky carb , JE pistons dome, Brodix BB2extra , roller , ect. gapless top /gapless second / conventional ? oh 1/16 1/16 3/16 ,thanks
 
Posts: 5 | Location: gap pa. | Registered: November 27, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
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For a bracket engine, I'd use 1/16 top, 1/16 napier 2nd and a std tension oil ring...


.
Dave



F J B

 
Posts: 4433 | Location: Earth | Registered: February 08, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
Picture of wideopen231
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Not engine builder by trade,but have built a butt load of them. With blown alky and injected motors I have always had good luck with Total seal.Have run both gapless top and gapless second with equal results. If bracket engine I see no reason not to go 1/16 top and second and either std or low tension oil ring. You can gain a cpl hp maybe with fancy thinner rings but IMO for bracket you will never see the difference and going to cost you more than likely more cash.

Give total seal a call.It will not cost a dime to see what they recommend.




America home of free. Brought to you by 2nd amendment.
 
Posts: 4133 | Location: Greensboro NC | Registered: May 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of Bad News
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C-33
Napier
3/16, but medium or low tension. If you are using a vacuum pump the low tension will be fine.
 
Posts: 868 | Location: ft laud | Registered: September 02, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of 329L
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.043-.043-3mm with gas ports for over 10 years. Will make 300 runs with no problems. I also believe they seal better, for longer.


Jeremiah Hall
 
Posts: 700 | Location: Evansville, IN | Registered: February 24, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of sr4440
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Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.

Joe

This message has been edited. Last edited by: sr4440,


Without data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.
 
Posts: 1297 | Location: TEXAS | Registered: February 07, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
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Gapless second, standard tension oil.
 
Posts: 9398 | Location: Madeira Beach Fl. | Registered: June 12, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Pro
Picture of CURTIS REED
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440:
Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.

Joe


Joe, what is the radial dimensions of the .9mm ring?



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Posts: 2889 | Location: KIEFER, OK. | Registered: August 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike Rietow:
Gapless second, standard tension oil.


So wrong it's not even funny
 
Posts: 2125 | Location: Tewksbury, MA,USA | Registered: November 03, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440:
Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.

Joe


Used this ring packages for years now. Works great, only suggestion is to modify the oil rings from 11 to 21 lbs unless you use a dry sump! And you won't loose HP with this swap also!

BTW the second ring in a Napier ring.
 
Posts: 2125 | Location: Tewksbury, MA,USA | Registered: November 03, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of CURTIS REED
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440:
Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.

Joe


Used this ring packages for years now. Works great, only suggestion is to modify the oil rings from 11 to 21 lbs unless you use a dry sump! And you won't loose HP with this swap also!

BTW the second ring in a Napier ring.


How about a 16lb oil ring with the vacuum pump instead of the 21?



____________________________
2017 and 2018 Osage Casinos Tulsa Raceway Park No-Box Champion

2018 Div4 Goodguys Hammer award winner
 
Posts: 2889 | Location: KIEFER, OK. | Registered: August 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440:
Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.

Joe


Used this ring packages for years now. Works great, only suggestion is to modify the oil rings from 11 to 21 lbs unless you use a dry sump! And you won't loose HP with this swap also!

BTW the second ring in a Napier ring.


How about a 16lb oil ring with the vacuum pump instead of the 21?


I would say this, the larger the CID of the motor the more windage splash there is and therefore the need for more oil control! I run a 632 BBC in brackets and TD, I switch this past winter from the 11 to 21 or 23 lbs oil rings, you definitely feel the difference rotating the motor over by hand between the two rings but the car was faster this year by a small amount with no other changes. Oil is not good when it gets into the combustion chamber. Before I swapped I was also considering something in the middle too like you suggested but decided not to and I was glad I did.

I also run a vacuum pump..
 
Posts: 2125 | Location: Tewksbury, MA,USA | Registered: November 03, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of CURTIS REED
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440:
Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.

Joe


Used this ring packages for years now. Works great, only suggestion is to modify the oil rings from 11 to 21 lbs unless you use a dry sump! And you won't loose HP with this swap also!

BTW the second ring in a Napier ring.


How about a 16lb oil ring with the vacuum pump instead of the 21?


I would say this, the larger the CID of the motor the more windage splash there is and therefore the need for more oil control! I run a 632 BBC in brackets and TD, I switch this past winter from the 11 to 21 or 23 lbs oil rings, you definitely feel the difference rotating the motor over by hand between the two rings but the car was faster this year by a small amount with no other changes. Oil is not good when it gets into the combustion chamber. Before I swapped I was also considering something in the middle too like you suggested but decided not to and I was glad I did.

I also run a vacuum pump..


Real world experience that you have is why I asked. I can get away with 11lb rings in my baby engines.



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2017 and 2018 Osage Casinos Tulsa Raceway Park No-Box Champion

2018 Div4 Goodguys Hammer award winner
 
Posts: 2889 | Location: KIEFER, OK. | Registered: August 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by Mike Rietow:
Gapless second, standard tension oil.


So wrong it's not even funny


n/a I run dykes
 
Posts: 9398 | Location: Madeira Beach Fl. | Registered: June 12, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Sportsman
Picture of sr4440
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440:
Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.

Joe


Joe, what is the radial dimensions of the .9mm ring?



.125” radial depth

3mm oil rings are 8 lbs

Page 16 https://assets.website-files.c...totalsealCatalog.pdf

Joe


Without data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.
 
Posts: 1297 | Location: TEXAS | Registered: February 07, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of CURTIS REED
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440:
quote:
Originally posted by CURTIS REED:
quote:
Originally posted by sr4440:
Since there is no “off the shelf” pistons available for my engine, I called total seal and asked what would be a good bracket racing piston ring, they recommend the AP ULTRA-THIN RING pack. .9mm .9mm 3mm oil with vertical gas ports and a vacuum pump. He gave me the measurements to have the ring groves made. The 1/16 rings look huge next to the .9mm. I haven’t used them yet, but I looking forward to getting it on the dyno.

Joe


Joe, what is the radial dimensions of the .9mm ring?



.125” radial depth

3mm oil rings are 8 lbs

Page 16 https://assets.website-files.c...totalsealCatalog.pdf

Joe


Wow, 32 grams lighter than .0625 rings although I don’t know at what diameter that difference represents.



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2017 and 2018 Osage Casinos Tulsa Raceway Park No-Box Champion

2018 Div4 Goodguys Hammer award winner
 
Posts: 2889 | Location: KIEFER, OK. | Registered: August 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
posted Hide Post
One thing to remember about the tension on oil rings, what they go in at is not what they stay at, they loose some tension..

Just food for thought.
 
Posts: 2125 | Location: Tewksbury, MA,USA | Registered: November 03, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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