The NHRA is down...Force parked it because of the MONEY...so will many sportsman racers.

There are 7 divisions and possibly 2 fill the fields in TS and TD? I can count man...

You can deny all you like...more racers are moving to bracket racing than ever...luckily we all have choices.

Force will be back next year.. Sportsman racing is not effected by the NHRA cuts to the Pro classes, local bracket racing is and has been dying and big $ bracket racing is now saturated with events that less than 10% of the cars/drivers on the property have the car(s) and skills to win. Many supporting these events are maxing out credit cards, getting loans, borrowing the $ and taking on partners to pay their entries. At some point, participation will fall off. Racers will either give up on Big $ Gambler races or will need to chose which event(s) they can/will support.

Again, NO ONE racing in LUCAS OIL DRAG RACING SERIES or the CAMPING WORLD DRAG RACING SERIES does so for the $, NO ONE!!!

Take your favorite event flyer and turn it upside down, and study it. (i.e., read it from the bottom up) What does it take to cover your entry? I heard there are going to be two events next year (one Footbrake and one Top E.T.) that will pay FIVE HUNDRED DOLLAR round money...

Win 4th round of the main event, and it will cover MORE than the entire weekend's entry fees for FIVE races: two $3K's, two $12.5K's, and a $75K.

That's real value for your hard-earned dollar.

as bad as I hate to say this, I agree with 1290 on this. I seen it in the 90's when every week somebody was running a 10k or 20k race. which was big $ then. everybody was in the promoting business it seemed. I do fear that with the number of big $ races that are being held the market can not support them all. and I am afraid that it will shrink. people will pick and choose the events they attend and like I have said if the 90% do the math and honestly look at their odds I am not sure why it hasn't already started to decline. I hope it doesn't, but it will happen eventually.

now on nhra. I enjoy that type of racing and have chose to spend my money there. I have done the math and no it is not the best investment. but I work for a living and race for a hobby. 1290 is correct that 99% are there for the willy and could cae less about the $. I am not quite like that and look to win or at minimum break even. the willys are nice but when I am dead I don't care that much about them either. I have to hear my wife complain about the dust they collect.

luckily at this point in time there is plenty to go around and everyone can race what and where they want which is a good thing.

ep-pray the election goes right or it may all come to an end sooner than later.

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Chris, for me and thousands upon thousands of drag racers, THIS

https://www.nhra.com/news/2019/reading-sc

beats any big check we could ever hold and for me personally, this was the proudest moment I've ever experienced with my son, more than his first touchdown, more than his first hit at bat and even more than his college graduation 5 months earlier.

He may never win another but the fact is he has won on the NHRA big stage, something 99.9% of drag racers dream of and most will never do.

A proud Wally ball washer!!

I’ve been fortunate enough to win a few big races, but the time I let go on nothing at 3 cars in SC the one national a year I ran, still haunts me. I had won a divisional, but sure wanted that big wally sitting on the shelf too.

some honest replies.

ep....dinner on me next time we see you.

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
some honest replies.

ep....dinner on me next time we see you.

I like it 1290. but not looking the other way when I busted down will work to.

ep-1290 was there for moral support. that has to be worth something.

ok drinks too

Good replies...while we all don't and won't agree...time will tell.

The wally lost it's luster to the monetary potential elsewhere for me and others seeking a reward of some sort to win.

Mostly cant win every week...but when we do...its a REAL reward...not a trophy that pays the way.

Lynn the pirates post was long but nails it down well for both views I think. Well done Lynn.

As a past National event winner from the late 80's and a participant in many national events and divisional events I NEVER raced with the NHRA with the hope of making $$$$$. It was an ego trip and fun racing the big guys just to measure my abilities. Won some, lost a lot, but still fun no less. Even the year I sucked an intake valve on the starting line. Big money bracket races never really appealed to me, ran a few and won a few. Now that Im retired Im more interested in keeping my old butt active, I race for fun when I want to.

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Beard:
Take your favorite event flyer and turn it upside down, and study it. (i.e., read it from the bottom up) What does it take to cover your entry? I heard there are going to be two events next year (one Footbrake and one Top E.T.) that will pay FIVE HUNDRED DOLLAR round money...

Win 4th round of the main event, and it will cover MORE than the entire weekend's entry fees for FIVE races: two $3K's, two $12.5K's, and a $75K.

That's real value for your hard-earned dollar.

Michael, I respect you and your integrity and success as a promoter, BUT...

With one round of buybacks, only 12.5% (one out of every eight) entries are left after 4 rounds.

i.e 50% are gone after 2nd round, another 25% after 3rd round, and another 12.5% after 4th round, etc - and how many of the 12.5% that make it that far also ponied up an expensive buyback on top of that hefty entry fee?

And the 12.5% number I cite above aligns pretty closely with the 10% that Ed notes above "have the car(s) and skills to win."

Everybody else is just transferring their wealth to the 10% - 12%.

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Chris, NHRA racer participation is not down. In fact, class racers especially stock eliminator and super stock racers are constantly complaining about the quota system to enter national events and wanting the NHRA to allow MORE cars to enter. I also know that TD and TS always have a full field at least at D1 and D3 events.

Again, NHRA racing is not about the $ and NHRA cutting the purses of the Pros means NOTHING, it's just a talking point on internet forums for those that are not Pro racers to air their opinions. You can bet that everyone of the top 16 teams in each class that compete at ALL 22 National events every year will again be competing at every national next season.

At the Gators we had 22 in Super Street. Not sure what the rest of the Super classes had but, they were light.

I don't get to do it as much as I like, nor am I as good as I'd like to be. But, I sure do like super class racing. I have no clue why I like it as much as I do. It sure ain't the money. I'm usually on the stop when I'm bracket racing, too.

My wife recently asked why I race. I quickly answered I did it to prove to my old man I was could do something right. He's been gone 50 years. Who knows? What will we all do when we're not able to do it or there's no place left to do it?

Bruce at the Gators, Super Street had 32 and with it being just a month ago, near the end of this covid season and knowing many won't travel at this point in the season unless chasing the championship. I'm sure that's why every sportsman class had less than 100% quota. The Gators contested in March as it typically is fills the quota for all classes.

https://www.nhraeventreg.com/ListEventStatus.asp

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Chris, for me and thousands upon thousands of drag racers, THIS

https://www.nhra.com/news/2019/reading-sc

beats any big check we could ever hold and for me personally, this was the proudest moment I've ever experienced with my son, more than his first touchdown, more than his first hit at bat and even more than his college graduation 5 months earlier.

He may never win another but the fact is he has won on the NHRA big stage, something 99.9% of drag racers dream of and most will never do.

A proud Wally ball washer!!

I’ve been fortunate enough to win a few big races, but the time I let go on nothing at 3 cars in SC the one national a year I ran, still haunts me. I had won a divisional, but sure wanted that big wally sitting on the shelf too.

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Bruce at the Gators, Super Street had 32 and with it being just a month ago, near the end of this covid season and knowing many won't travel at this point in the season unless chasing the championship. I'm sure that's why every sportsman class had less than 100% quota. The Gators contested in March as it typically is fills the quota for all classes.

https://www.nhraeventreg.com/ListEventStatus.asp

Ed, I think you're right. My National Dragster hit the garbage yesterday. I think Randy Whitener having the bye second round threw me off on the count.

Since I feel like talking tonight, there's a lot of money put out to enter a national event, just like a big money race

NATIONAL EVENT
Must have enough entry points to enter
Travel to at least five plus divisional events
Pay for a number in each category, membership
Spend at least three days to win a race

BIG MONEY
Show up and pay as long you don't have a piece of **** race car you can get into four/five races in one weekend.

To each their own, each have their own appeal.

PS Next year is the year of the Chevelle! Lol

I won't quote it because of its length, but the Pirate sure gave a great perspective. Thank you Lynn.

I think another thing to think about in this conversation is the equipment investment. This is not a haves vs have nots statement. But rather a statement about exactly how much you are willing to spend on this part of your life. We all have other parts of our lives....or at least should! How much should we sacrifice in other areas for racing? And let's not be silly…..if we are racing, we are sacrificing. We could spend more on our house, or our retirement or our kid's education or driving nicer vehicles or working less, if we didn't pour money into our racing. The race cars are only one part of this. A large part of people who consistently race any NHRA national events OR big money events, invest in the standard issue Toter/stacker combo. Some do the pusher motorhome and a more modest trailer. Ed is actually the small money spender in this case, showing up at NHRA events with a pickup truck. Sure the toter/stacker is a status symbol to some. But they also make race weekends a lot more livable. The pull like they were made to do it...because they were. The carry lots of water, and have enough sleeping room for most teams. And they can bring to the track everything you need for spares and tools. But they are UBER expensive too. No way your grassroots racer can justify it usually, and frankly, most of our population in the USA could not actually afford it period. Most live in houses that cost less than that combo.
And yes yes yes I know there are some that still show up and either tent camp or hit a nearby hotel. I know that. But that has become the exception. Facebook has probably been a mistake for me to join as I generally tell people what I think. But on the jr page for a local track one mother of a jr racer stated that they can't justify racing jrs locally because they need to make the money the big races have in order to justify and pay back some of their investment. (recent toterhome purchasers) I told her that she may want to have her head examined if she thinks traveling for days to chase the chance of money in order to justify and pay for many hundreds of thousands of dollars makes sense. This sport has become more expensive for them than most any crack addict's habits. If your equipment is dictating to you where you will race, you are a little mixed up.

This is just one of the reasons I think it is so important to have healthy local racing that grassroots racers and competitive long standing racers can enjoy. Where else can people get started? Where else can those who have a modest racing budget actually compete on that level playing field that bracket racing was designed to provide? Where else are you going to test your new combo, and get your kid licensed or have them take their first passes in a jr or full sized race car? The nationals and divisionals and the money races are nice to have. But we really do NEED local tracks and we need them to stay healthy enough to turn a profit and be there for us.

quote:

Originally posted by Bucky:
A large part of people who consistently race any NHRA national events OR big money events, invest in the standard issue Toter/stacker combo. Some do the pusher motorhome and a more modest trailer. Ed is actually the small money spender in this case, showing up at NHRA events with a pickup truck.

I am and I like that.

I've been on the fence for years now about buying a motorhome. pros and cons depending on your situation. For me right now more cons than pros.

I can stay at the best chain hotels for the rest of my life and still not spend the $ I will on the used rig I would buy. Also it's just me and my son, my wife ain't coming to cook for us and like the hotels, I can eat at the best restaurants in the area of the host track for the rest of my life and still combined with the hotel costs will not spend the $ I will on the used rig I would buy. Also with a MH, you are STUCK at the track on rainy days and after racing is done for the day unless of course you rent a car or bring along with you a smart car that I'm now seeing roll out stackers. IMO its ridiculous. At an event a few months back, friends of mine who have one of the most expensive Show Haulers and stackers on the property were ever they go were happy to be able to get in my pickup leave the track every evening with us to have dinner and drinks. so for me the convenience of being able to sleep at the track isn't worth the buy in cost no mind the maintenance. We also don't race to 3-4-5am in the morning.

Oh and if I roll into an event late, I can find a spot a lot easier than a truck with a stacker and if I end up in the dirt, I'm in a good neighborhood surrounded by half a million dollar rigs.

Back on topic...The Purse which NO ONE racing in the LUCAS OIL DRAG RACING SERIES or the CAMPING WORLD DRAG RACING SERIES does so for the $, NO ONE!!!

Bruce,

You also have to remember the Gators for sportsman was really the Southern Nats in Atlanta, they had already run the sportsman portion of the Gators back in March before COVID struck and Atlanta always has way lower quotas then Gainesville does. A lot of the Northern folk head South in Jan/Feb/March to get away from the snow up here and hit Orlando, South Georgia, Baby Gators and the Gators to get a quick jump on the racing season since D1 doesn't really get rolling till early May, this year you had Maple Grove D1 race and St. Louis had a double D3 race on top of that Gators National and I know I talked to a few D1 people who were on the fence because they needed National points and really didn't want to have to travel back down to Fla again. The unfortunate part was once we got rolling after COVID it was a lot of event slammed into a little window of time.