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DRR Trophy
posted
I've dabbled a bit before with an alcohol system years ago but looking at adding a simple plate kit to my car now and have some questions. It's a 4.60 dragster with a 2.400" bore Q16 carb.

I have a Magnafuel 500 pump feeding a BG 4 port deadhead regulator with -6 lines feeding each bowl of the carburetor. Would it be feasible to just add another line from the regulator to feed the fuel solenoid? On my previous system, I used a separate regulator just for the fuel side of the nitrous system but I'm wondering if that's overkill for what I'm trying to do here, which is....spray 100hp for a few seconds to pick up about a tenth on one qualifying pass then put the bottle in the trailer for the rest of the weekend. I'm going to spray this thing a total of about 15 seconds in an entire season.

Any feedback would be appreciated but right now I'm just looking at the NX 30070 plate system and keeping it as simple as possible.
 
Posts: 59 | Location: D3 | Registered: May 24, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Alaskaracer
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NO! You need to run a separate regulator for the nitrous system. Flowing fuel pressure for the nitrous system is calculated through a jet, usually a .073 if the system has been flowed and mapped by someone like Robert Lane or Steve Johnson. For the NX stuff they give you the proper jet size for each level to flow your fuel pressure though...But, if you flow fuel pressure through the recommended jet with a flow tool, then recheck it without the jet and regular gauge, You'll find a big difference in settings....

I made that mistake on my stuff, set carb regulators with my flow tool...Actual fuel pressure at the carbs was less than 3psi....But with the flow tool it showed 6.5 because of the jet...

Also, when you engage the system, there will be a pressure drop which could affect the carb. But if you don't set flowing fuel pressure on the system as recommended with the proper jet and a flow tool, you'll play hell finding the right tune up.....all the factory tunes are based on flowing fuel pressure with a specific jet and a flow tool...


Mark Goulette
Owner/Driver of the Livin' The Dream Racing dragster
www.livinthedreamracing.com
"Speed kills but it's better than going slow!"
Authorized Amsoil Retailer
 
Posts: 1505 | Location: Back home in Alaska! | Registered: February 13, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by sc3171:
I've dabbled a bit before with an alcohol system years ago but looking at adding a simple plate kit to my car now and have some questions. It's a 4.60 dragster with a 2.400" bore Q16 carb.

I have a Magnafuel 500 pump feeding a BG 4 port deadhead regulator with -6 lines feeding each bowl of the carburetor. Would it be feasible to just add another line from the regulator to feed the fuel solenoid? On my previous system, I used a separate regulator just for the fuel side of the nitrous system but I'm wondering if that's overkill for what I'm trying to do here, which is....spray 100hp for a few seconds to pick up about a tenth on one qualifying pass then put the bottle in the trailer for the rest of the weekend. I'm going to spray this thing a total of about 15 seconds in an entire season.

Any feedback would be appreciated but right now I'm just looking at the NX 30070 plate system and keeping it as simple as possible.


I would say probably due to the low HP of spray your looking for. However your tune up should take into account how much fuel pressure your currently running. Fuel provides the power and the NO2 provides the O2 to burn it. Although no manufacturer is likely to OK this setup, I'd say the regulator and pump can provide enough fuel for both. I would also tell you to be conservative with timing! Too much timing hurts parts more than too much or too little fuel. Take out 6 degrees to start with for 100 HP. You will also have to turn it on very early in the run to pick up a tenth, like 0.250 out.
 
Posts: 2161 | Location: Tewksbury, MA,USA | Registered: November 03, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Coloradoracer:
NO! You need to run a separate regulator for the nitrous system. Flowing fuel pressure for the nitrous system is calculated through a jet, usually a .073 if the system has been flowed and mapped by someone like Robert Lane or Steve Johnson. For the NX stuff they give you the proper jet size for each level to flow your fuel pressure though...But, if you flow fuel pressure through the recommended jet with a flow tool, then recheck it without the jet and regular gauge, You'll find a big difference in settings....

I made that mistake on my stuff, set carb regulators with my flow tool...Actual fuel pressure at the carbs was less than 3psi....But with the flow tool it showed 6.5 because of the jet...

Also, when you engage the system, there will be a pressure drop which could affect the carb. But if you don't set flowing fuel pressure on the system as recommended with the proper jet and a flow tool, you'll play hell finding the right tune up.....all the factory tunes are based on flowing fuel pressure with a specific jet and a flow tool...


Yeah, I recall using the flow tool to check pressure on my last setup. Is there a regulator that you would recommend, keeping in mind that I'm using Q16 (not sure if this will make a difference, but I recall buying a little more expensive regulator than just the little Holley one when I was spraying alcohol)
 
Posts: 59 | Location: D3 | Registered: May 24, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sc3171:
I've dabbled a bit before with an alcohol system years ago but looking at adding a simple plate kit to my car now and have some questions. It's a 4.60 dragster with a 2.400" bore Q16 carb.

I have a Magnafuel 500 pump feeding a BG 4 port deadhead regulator with -6 lines feeding each bowl of the carburetor. Would it be feasible to just add another line from the regulator to feed the fuel solenoid? On my previous system, I used a separate regulator just for the fuel side of the nitrous system but I'm wondering if that's overkill for what I'm trying to do here, which is....spray 100hp for a few seconds to pick up about a tenth on one qualifying pass then put the bottle in the trailer for the rest of the weekend. I'm going to spray this thing a total of about 15 seconds in an entire season.

Any feedback would be appreciated but right now I'm just looking at the NX 30070 plate system and keeping it as simple as possible.


I would say probably due to the low HP of spray your looking for. However your tune up should take into account how much fuel pressure your currently running. Fuel provides the power and the NO2 provides the O2 to burn it. Although no manufacturer is likely to OK this setup, I'd say the regulator and pump can provide enough fuel for both. I would also tell you to be conservative with timing! Too much timing hurts parts more than too much or too little fuel. Take out 6 degrees to start with for 100 HP. You will also have to turn it on very early in the run to pick up a tenth, like 0.250 out.


My carb pressure is about 6 psi. NX recommends 8-10 on their jetting. Why couldn’t I counteract the lower pressure by adjusting the fuel jet like you’re saying? Surely there’s enough volume at the regulator to do both? Not real sure which direction to go here. Don’t really want to over complicate things but certainly don’t want to hurt anything either.
 
Posts: 59 | Location: D3 | Registered: May 24, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by sc3171:
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sc3171:
I've dabbled a bit before with an alcohol system years ago but looking at adding a simple plate kit to my car now and have some questions. It's a 4.60 dragster with a 2.400" bore Q16 carb.

I have a Magnafuel 500 pump feeding a BG 4 port deadhead regulator with -6 lines feeding each bowl of the carburetor. Would it be feasible to just add another line from the regulator to feed the fuel solenoid? On my previous system, I used a separate regulator just for the fuel side of the nitrous system but I'm wondering if that's overkill for what I'm trying to do here, which is....spray 100hp for a few seconds to pick up about a tenth on one qualifying pass then put the bottle in the trailer for the rest of the weekend. I'm going to spray this thing a total of about 15 seconds in an entire season.

Any feedback would be appreciated but right now I'm just looking at the NX 30070 plate system and keeping it as simple as possible.


I would say probably due to the low HP of spray your looking for. However your tune up should take into account how much fuel pressure your currently running. Fuel provides the power and the NO2 provides the O2 to burn it. Although no manufacturer is likely to OK this setup, I'd say the regulator and pump can provide enough fuel for both. I would also tell you to be conservative with timing! Too much timing hurts parts more than too much or too little fuel. Take out 6 degrees to start with for 100 HP. You will also have to turn it on very early in the run to pick up a tenth, like 0.250 out.


My carb pressure is about 6 psi. NX recommends 8-10 on their jetting. Why couldn’t I counteract the lower pressure by adjusting the fuel jet like you’re saying? Surely there’s enough volume at the regulator to do both? Not real sure which direction to go here. Don’t really want to over complicate things but certainly don’t want to hurt anything either.


You can do everything you're talking. I'd call NX, FastLane, PKRE, Induction Solutions, discuss all this mentioned in here. Whoever doesn't act like you're waisting their time gets your business. Anyone of these people can come up with a 6 psi tune, jetting the nine yards. It's just a matter of which seems more interested.

Call em that's what I'd do, it'll save ya burning fuel monkeying with it.
 
Posts: 9398 | Location: Madeira Beach Fl. | Registered: June 12, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
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We bought a little DXP Street cheater plate kit from FastLane.I messaged him on FB about a question and boom, he replied right back. I know this guy would get ya going quick. We like this guy work'n out good. Product is nice and he's down to earth.
 
Posts: 9398 | Location: Madeira Beach Fl. | Registered: June 12, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Sportsman
Picture of N2Ofrog
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Not optimal but for spraying smaller amounts that setup should work fine.

You can use a bigger fuel jet to compensate for the lower pressure. Will also need a little additional fuel since using Q16.

If going with a separate regulator, Holley 803 is the best choice.
 
Posts: 929 | Location: Columbia Station, OH | Registered: January 05, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by sc3171:
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sc3171:
I've dabbled a bit before with an alcohol system years ago but looking at adding a simple plate kit to my car now and have some questions. It's a 4.60 dragster with a 2.400" bore Q16 carb.

I have a Magnafuel 500 pump feeding a BG 4 port deadhead regulator with -6 lines feeding each bowl of the carburetor. Would it be feasible to just add another line from the regulator to feed the fuel solenoid? On my previous system, I used a separate regulator just for the fuel side of the nitrous system but I'm wondering if that's overkill for what I'm trying to do here, which is....spray 100hp for a few seconds to pick up about a tenth on one qualifying pass then put the bottle in the trailer for the rest of the weekend. I'm going to spray this thing a total of about 15 seconds in an entire season.

Any feedback would be appreciated but right now I'm just looking at the NX 30070 plate system and keeping it as simple as possible.


I would say probably due to the low HP of spray your looking for. However your tune up should take into account how much fuel pressure your currently running. Fuel provides the power and the NO2 provides the O2 to burn it. Although no manufacturer is likely to OK this setup, I'd say the regulator and pump can provide enough fuel for both. I would also tell you to be conservative with timing! Too much timing hurts parts more than too much or too little fuel. Take out 6 degrees to start with for 100 HP. You will also have to turn it on very early in the run to pick up a tenth, like 0.250 out.


My carb pressure is about 6 psi. NX recommends 8-10 on their jetting. Why couldn’t I counteract the lower pressure by adjusting the fuel jet like you’re saying? Surely there’s enough volume at the regulator to do both? Not real sure which direction to go here. Don’t really want to over complicate things but certainly don’t want to hurt anything either.


I would call NX, I am sure they can recommend a starting tune up with 6 PSI of fuel pressure.

Like I stated before, spraying 100 HP for a few seconds is not a big deal. Some racers dry spray this deal. The two worst things you can do is have too much timing and next is run it way to rich, both can hurt parts/pistons!
 
Posts: 2161 | Location: Tewksbury, MA,USA | Registered: November 03, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
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Thanks guys. Original guidance from NX was that I would need 10 psi fuel pressure to do this.

I spoke with someone this morning who was able to give me a jetting chart based on 5 psi. Between the 5 and 10 psi jetting I've been given, surely I can figure it out. Maybe I just start with the 5 psi jetting since I'm using Q16.

Appreciate all the help. It seems there are 2 views on this. Those that say no it absolutely can't be done and others who say it's not optimal but will be fine.
 
Posts: 59 | Location: D3 | Registered: May 24, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sc3171:
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:
quote:
Originally posted by sc3171:
I've dabbled a bit before with an alcohol system years ago but looking at adding a simple plate kit to my car now and have some questions. It's a 4.60 dragster with a 2.400" bore Q16 carb.

I have a Magnafuel 500 pump feeding a BG 4 port deadhead regulator with -6 lines feeding each bowl of the carburetor. Would it be feasible to just add another line from the regulator to feed the fuel solenoid? On my previous system, I used a separate regulator just for the fuel side of the nitrous system but I'm wondering if that's overkill for what I'm trying to do here, which is....spray 100hp for a few seconds to pick up about a tenth on one qualifying pass then put the bottle in the trailer for the rest of the weekend. I'm going to spray this thing a total of about 15 seconds in an entire season.

Any feedback would be appreciated but right now I'm just looking at the NX 30070 plate system and keeping it as simple as possible.


I would say probably due to the low HP of spray your looking for. However your tune up should take into account how much fuel pressure your currently running. Fuel provides the power and the NO2 provides the O2 to burn it. Although no manufacturer is likely to OK this setup, I'd say the regulator and pump can provide enough fuel for both. I would also tell you to be conservative with timing! Too much timing hurts parts more than too much or too little fuel. Take out 6 degrees to start with for 100 HP. You will also have to turn it on very early in the run to pick up a tenth, like 0.250 out.


My carb pressure is about 6 psi. NX recommends 8-10 on their jetting. Why couldn’t I counteract the lower pressure by adjusting the fuel jet like you’re saying? Surely there’s enough volume at the regulator to do both? Not real sure which direction to go here. Don’t really want to over complicate things but certainly don’t want to hurt anything either.


I would call NX, I am sure they can recommend a starting tune up with 6 PSI of fuel pressure.

Like I stated before, spraying 100 HP for a few seconds is not a big deal. Some racers dry spray this deal. The two worst things you can do is have too much timing and next is run it way to rich, both can hurt parts/pistons!


Not disagreeing with ya or trying to confuse matters but your base timing Super Pro bracket is typically lower than when optimizing HP, isn't it?

I ran my base timing on the BBC's I ran 427 + 60 - 454 + 60 30 - 28 degree's respectively methanol. 250 - 300 hp nitrous override and never pulled any timing.

If I ran 100hp, I wouldn't pull any timing. It would be accounted for in the base timing.
 
Posts: 9398 | Location: Madeira Beach Fl. | Registered: June 12, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of TD3550
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Just curious.What is the combo on the deal? That 2.400 spec'd with proper angle channels and booster tubes/Wide body blocks? Ever try C 23?
 
Posts: 1410 | Location: Under a Truck | Registered: August 23, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by TD3550:
Just curious.What is the combo on the deal? That 2.400 spec'd with proper angle channels and booster tubes/Wide body blocks? Ever try C 23?


APD built and spec'd. Never tried C23.
 
Posts: 59 | Location: D3 | Registered: May 24, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
posted Hide Post
Just an update on this...

I ordered this kit: https://nitrousexpress.com/gem...500-flange-60070.asp

With this tool: https://www.nitrousexpress.com...gauge-incl-15519.asp

I used the existing 4 port regulator to feed the fuel solenoid and I checked the flowing fuel pressure using the tool above.

My fuel pressure was 6.5 and so I used the NX jetting chart for a 150hp shot with 5psi. My general thinking here was that the additional 1.5psi would be good since I'm using an oxygenated fuel.

I picked it up from a 4.71 to a 4.54 spraying from .25 to 2.25 seconds in the run and pulling 6 degrees of timing. Fuel pressure was steady on the racepak.
 
Posts: 59 | Location: D3 | Registered: May 24, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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