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Just an Oil Question?
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DRR Pro
Picture of Footloose
posted
Is it really a good idea to have Zinc mixed with synthetic oil? When I was a kid graphite was mixed with oil. My family ran it . Never a problem at 3K changes?
 
Posts: 1921 | Location: in a van down buy the river | Registered: September 07, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of 434 olds
posted Hide Post
Valvoline VR1 oil is fully synthetic with zinc.





Worlds Quickest And Fastest 71 Cutlass On The Planet Earth
 
Posts: 536 | Location: Oak ridge, N.J | Registered: February 09, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of SlyFox
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If you're running roller lifters, do you need zinc?


Mike
 
Posts: 1571 | Location: Marietta, GA | Registered: December 09, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
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Slyfox based on what I think I know I will say yes. It still has pushrods that see a high load and a sliding type wear. Maybe not as much zinc as an old ft engine, but still some is needed.
 
Posts: 509 | Location: Going to or returning from the chipmine. | Registered: July 01, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Elite
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I've been running synthetic oil in my race engines for over 3 decades and until 2017 I ran Mobil 1 10w-30. Since 2018 I've run Lucas 20W-50 and 10W-40 full synthetic until last year when we moved to Mr. Race Oil

https://mrraceoil.com/

a local oil manufacturer, running their 10W-40 synthetic oil. I've never concerned myself with how much zine is or is not in my oil nor have I added zinc to my oil, I pour it straight from the jug as formulated and I've been running roller lifters since 2000 and I have put over 1000 passes on Crower Serve Duty w/HIPPO roller lifters TWICE in my former 700+HP 468 that powered my Chevelle.
 
Posts: 13522 | Location: NJ | Registered: August 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of FootbrakeJim
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I don't think it is necessary to add Zinc to any oil, ever. If you are breaking in a new flat-tappet cam & lifters, (or even with a roller setup), I would recommend a good high-quality break-in oil such as those made by Lucas or Driven. Break-in oils already have higher levels of Zinc, so again, no need to ever add any. (Note, most break-in oils are non-synthetic which allows for proper seating of the rings).
And as 434 Olds mentioned, any of the Valvoline VR1 Race Oils, whether you choose the blue Full Synthetic that comes in black bottles, (which I use), or the standard non-synthetic dinosaur/petroleum formula in the gray/silver jug, all have high levels of Zinc in them. I believe virtually every motor oil you can buy has Zinc in it, even the Walmart house brand.


Dan "Jim" Moore
Much too young to feel this damn old!!
 
Posts: 1055 | Location: Farmersville, TX  | Registered: December 05, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of BD104X
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Most manufacturers ARE phasing zinc out of their oils because it harms the emission systems in modern cars, so just because you "never added zinc before and never had a problem" or always used brand X doesn't mean you wont have an issue in the future. The lack of zinc in modern oil is only supposed to be an issue on flat-tappet cams & lifters from everything I have read. If you have roller lifters, you shouldn't have an issue. Several manufacturers offer oil with zinc for older or classic cars - I use Amsoil so I buy their "Z-Rod" to use in my old Corvette with a flat-tappet 327. I've heard mixed results on zinc additives.


Billy Duhs - BD104X@gmail.com
 
Posts: 638 | Location: New Jersey | Registered: February 26, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Pro
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Here’s two oil samples of same weight in full synthetic from different companies. I’ve used both and one is much less expensive than the other.

Super Tech

Pennzoil
 
Posts: 2537 | Location: 53056 | Registered: December 30, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of CURTIS REED
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ZDDP in synthetic or dino oils is a good idea whether roller or not. The only time it really matters on a roller engine is IF you have a problem.

I see posts about people adding a ZDDP supplement to their oil and if you feel the need to do that then you are running the wrong oil. Very few on here are smarter about the product than the engineer designing the blend. One thing lots of guys don't realize is that too much ZDDP can turn into an abrasive. I've done lots of reading about oils and it's a really interesting topic but highly polarizing. Not quite as bad as roller lifter brands though. LOL It's polarizing because modern oils are so good that most don't have problems and will suggest only what they have used. Case in point is how many guys think Rotella is the best oil to use in a race engine.

To answer your question, yes it's a good idea to have zinc in your synthetic oil (if your application should have it) but not added as a supplement IMO.



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Posts: 3020 | Location: KIEFER, OK. | Registered: August 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
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Zinc or other extreme pressure anti-wear motor oil components come into play at the failure of the maximum film strength / load carrying capability / shear resistance value, which takes place at the same time as the boundary lubrication reaches its limit. Or just before the parts involved would seize. While that is a very necessary feature, more directly one would want to use an oil with a superior film strength rating. Along with oil flow rate and viscosity. Today's 5w30 offer the highest film strength ratings.


Illegitimi non carborundum
 
Posts: 2349 | Location: OKC, OK | Registered: February 15, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of FootbrakeJim
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Like Billy said, each new revision of the API service rating has further reduced Zinc content, to protect catalytic converters and emission systems. That is why the higher-Zinc racing oils (and oil marketed for older cars, muscle cars, etc) are usually rated SL by the API, and some race oils specify they are not intended for use in street legal passenger cars. The newest API rating of SP has about half of what the old SG and SH oils had. Diesel oils historically had higher Zinc content than oils for gasoline engines, which is why (as Curtis mentioned), a lot of racers and builders used and recommended Rotella diesel oil back in the day. Many still do use it, but Diesel oils no longer have that high Zinc formula as in the past.
Markemark, thanks for sharing those links to the oil analysis. It sure looks to me like the Walmart Supertech oil is better than the Pennzoil stuff. Also, I did not know that Pennzoil manufactures Quaker State, nor that they are either owned by, or made by, Shell Oil in Houston. (I do not use any oils from any of those 3 companies, other than sometimes Rotella (Shell) in my diesel pickup). I would like to know who makes the Supertech house brand oil for Walmart.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: FootbrakeJim,


Dan "Jim" Moore
Much too young to feel this damn old!!
 
Posts: 1055 | Location: Farmersville, TX  | Registered: December 05, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
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Well hell piss would be better than PENNZCRAP use VR1 3 quarts remainder 10-30 valvoline synthetic regular oil mixes fine over 15 years and no bearing problems


The difference between ignorance and stupidity. Ignorance is lack of knowledge. Stupidity is the inability to learn. Don't be stupid
 
Posts: 425 | Location: des moines iowa | Registered: January 10, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
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quote:
I would like to know who makes the Supertech house brand oil for Walmart.


"Supertech oil is made by Warren Oil Company, Inc., one of America’s largest independent lubricant manufacturers." Warren also makes Amazon Basic and the line of oil Costco carries. Tested and proven to be a very good, cost effective, product by Project Farm.


Illegitimi non carborundum
 
Posts: 2349 | Location: OKC, OK | Registered: February 15, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Footloose
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My valvoline is old oil too. High zinc not synthetic. I have been lucky never lost a flat tappet lifter or cam. Some times I think there is such a thing as too slippery,keeping the cushion of the oil off of the surface. Maybe I am wrong.
 
Posts: 1921 | Location: in a van down buy the river | Registered: September 07, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR S/Pro
Picture of Eman
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If you want synthetic oil with a good ZDDP package look at Mobil 1 racing oil. I use it in a flat tappet SBC. I have used Mobil 1 10w-30 and added Lucas zinc additive in the same motor but it seemed to settle out and turn the oil an odd color.
 
Posts: 1497 | Location: E TN | Registered: February 13, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Footloose
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Eman years ago I used something called Royal Purple. Never 1 oil related failure. Do not remember why I changed. Maybe availabilty at the time.
 
Posts: 1921 | Location: in a van down buy the river | Registered: September 07, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Elite
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Royal purple was all the rage probably 25 years ago with the stock, super stock, comp crowd dur to their light weight #9 and #11 IIRC but has long since fell out of favor with the company being sold and the fact that their are many racing oil companies today that offer light weight oil for the go fast crowd. If you want to use a racing oil there are many to chose from today besides Lucas and Mr. Race Oil that I mentioned I have used. MAXIMA is another that I have used. There’s also LAT, Driven, Red Line, Schaeffer and others. Most bracket racers use whatever is the cheapest and easiest to get. Again, Mobil 1 is more than good enough for most bracket racers as well cheap and easy to get.
 
Posts: 13522 | Location: NJ | Registered: August 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
Picture of Curly1
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Footbrake Jim is right, most are phasing out all of the Zinc for all street cars. I use Valvoline VR1 because it has Zinc. Looks like that MrRaceoil stuff has zinc to.
When I did my research the Valvoline VR1 seemed to be best overall in most tests and readily available so that is what I stick with now.


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Before you argue with someone ask yourself, "Is this person mentally mature enough to grasp the concept of a different perspective?" If not there is no point to argue.

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Posts: 4129 | Location: United States of Texas | Registered: April 02, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
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I have primarily used synthetic Mobil 1, Lucas & sometimes Valvoline oil; any additives (seldomly used) has been Lucas. I'll stick with proven oils that are used by a good many bracket racers & is readily available. Wink

2BKING Big Grin


1980 Camaro
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Posts: 2642 | Location: NV. | Registered: October 20, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Alaskaracer
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Say what you will, but Amsoil has been working great for me and I see no benefit in switching. I wouldn't use Royal Purple in my weed whacker, or anything Penzoil for that matter.


Mark Goulette
Owner/Driver of the Livin' The Dream Racing dragster
www.livinthedreamracing.com
"Speed kills but it's better than going slow!"
Authorized Amsoil Retailer
 
Posts: 1504 | Location: Back home in Alaska! | Registered: February 13, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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