I have found the same thing as Ed has on reaction times. Im still trying to figure out what is done different than a cast iron, and its not standing out. Only thing i can think of is the valvebody is doing a much better job of taking the line pressure we are putting through it. You have to remember, a glide was NEVER meant to be over 120 psi. We double that now. Iron or not, it wasnt designed to handle that kind of pressure.

I agree there would be a difference between each material for speed of release. I do not think the repeatability of the same material would be any greater than the other. i.e I don't think the bell curve for one would be any wider than another for speed of release, the actual speed yes possibly (center point) but not the variation. Would love to see data on release variations.

As long as were are talking Transmission just my 02 here as yes we should be. 283 or a 959 ci doesnt matter if that trans-brake release is not consistant you might as well be foot brake'n it as you will be skipping past the release issue if you have one.

My spare trans is an Abruzzi with a stock case
Built with his Pro Tree iron VB brake.....double dump as they are called
I changed it to a Hipster Iron Pro Brake which is not the double dump type and I modified the case as per the ATD instructions for their brakes.
I used a Hipster probably around 1990 and it was very fast....and they still are and that trans got faster, not a lot but was always pretty good.
I took it apart more than once and reseal and check it....Like new inside


That stock case trans won me 3 Wally's in S/C

I bought a Dedenbaer cased trans and it is slower....double dump type Pro Brake. Not a lot slower but a little. It was gone thru by a local builder mostly to get the case re-certed

Only reason I bought an aluminum brake was because they are supposed to be the fastest thanks to quality machining and design of internal passages

That did not hold true for me....

The swap I just did will be a real good test to compare brakes.....Is it the brake or the trans itself or something else....

I don't chase points, race when I feel like it.....do the best I can when I do get out there....

I have log books going back a number of years and always look at my notes regarding RT's and Delay settings....

I have good days and bad....I don't blame the car when I s-u-c-k

I was hoping that VB would be faster but the results at more than one track say it's not.....

I don't always s-u-c-k......Can recall one day at Atco having 2 .000's along with a -.005 and a .006 in succession and only making small delay box changes....

At least 2 times I've gotten the rd 1 bye thanks to a .000 RT on the last TT in S/C at 2 different tracks at NHRA division races....

Even a monkey can let go of button when he sees a light go on.....was one of my favorite old sayings when delay boxes came along....

This message has been edited. Last edited by: SCDIV1,

When I was chasing the 370 Pro Tree Bradenton staged shallow. From 039 green I took the trans apart and went to 3 reverse clutches and heavy reverse piston springs on every other spring. I may have reduced clutches in high drum as well, at that point.

I also tested several buttons and found the Applied Racing Technology red mushroom top button to be quite a bit faster than all the micro switches I had in stock, and the B & M mushroom top in the car now, I use for Super Pro bracket racing. The car went double 0 on the 370 at Bradenton next time out. I think the button was 011 - 012 faster than the B & M I had in the car, 007-008 better than micro's I had in stock.

I was using a JW iron VB, very impressive VB in that realm of racing.

This was a really competitive 370 pro tree race, I thought. Fun race to be in.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Mike Rietow,

So the ?? is it worth getting a billet alum or keep it steel?

If after reading my and and 329L’s last replies you’re still asking, then I don’t know what you’re looking for.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 1320racer,

In my earlier post about an older Alumn. valve body it worked great as when top bulb racing I just could put numbers in the box. I only removed it and went to the slower bracket spring release valvebody because I needed to loose reaction time on the bottom to keep it green. The one I have again is an older Hipster and works great no problems and will keep it If I ever go super class racing on pro tree again. You can bet if 1320racer has a new BTE and it was even in question it would be out and in the garbage pile. For the price of a valvebody hes not going to let a nickle hold up a dollar and neither will I. Also the solenoids are a factor as they do not all release the same speed. They are close and I have also tried and have a co2 release that can dump at once or bleed down. The more volts you put to the solenoid the slower it will release. A T/B solenoid will release quicker at 9 volts than 13 and maybe some one on here knows why maybe fly back voltage or coil bleed down voltage as someone smarter than me might know why.

Trying to clean out race parts. Just emptied a 5 gal bucket in the trash with glide core bits including Valve Bodies. Just to big of a hassle to sell them or convert to race.

quote:

Originally posted by HR3377:
So the ?? is it worth getting a billet alum or keep it steel?

There are a whole lot of these billet valvebody's out being used without any issues. I Believe the BTE was one of the first developed, I think FTI was a year or so behind. The Coan was released about 1-2 years ago. I had one if the original FTIs about 6 years ago and like I said I had issues about a year after I got it but im not saying dont buy one because there are lots of them out there in winning cars.Maybe whatever was causing the problem I was having has been fixed.
Its your money, if your in need of a new valvebody you have to decide whether the extra $200-300 is worth it. If your current cast iron VB is working and consistant I dont think you will see any difference other than a lighter wallet and VB. JMO

quote:

Originally posted by SCDIV1:

quote:

Originally posted by Big Steve:
I had a similar issue as SCDIV1 with a early FTI Billet valve body. It worked great at first then after time it got really inconsistent, the steel TB apply valve had wore the aluminum bore in the VB causing it to stick. If you are looking to save weight the aluminum VB is great but unless they have steel sleeves in the bores of the steel valves you may possibly have some consistency issues in the log run. I went back to a cast iron VB, the 9lbs savings wasn't worth the trouble

I knew it could not be just me !!

What a waste of $$ that purchase was for me....Did not speed up Vehicle RT's and when I went to the track for the first time and backed out of trailer the valve was stuck and car would not move forward.....

Once it warmed up and free'ed up it was ok and has worked decent since.....but I don't trust it....

I did have one race RT's were good earlier this year

Why do they put Bronze guides in Aluminum heads with steel valves? Because the steel will gall the aluminum and start sticking or wearing. Steel on steel or steel in a bronze sleeve or bushing will work. Some Aluminum alloys are better than others but still not optimum.
With the high pressure of the transmission fluid you may never have problems with the steel rod in the aluminum but I do think it would be better to have a steel or Bronze sleeve there. IMHO.

I looked into the aluminum valve body when we were all talking about them a while back and I thought then it did not sound very good. The steel rod in an aluminum bore was a red flag to me. At that time I decided not worth the time, money or potential problem and did not do it. The mixed reviews here reinforce my thoughts on them.

quote:

Originally posted by Curly1:

quote:

Originally posted by SCDIV1:

quote:

Originally posted by Big Steve:
I had a similar issue as SCDIV1 with a early FTI Billet valve body. It worked great at first then after time it got really inconsistent, the steel TB apply valve had wore the aluminum bore in the VB causing it to stick. If you are looking to save weight the aluminum VB is great but unless they have steel sleeves in the bores of the steel valves you may possibly have some consistency issues in the log run. I went back to a cast iron VB, the 9lbs savings wasn't worth the trouble

I knew it could not be just me !!

What a waste of $$ that purchase was for me....Did not speed up Vehicle RT's and when I went to the track for the first time and backed out of trailer the valve was stuck and car would not move forward.....

Once it warmed up and free'ed up it was ok and has worked decent since.....but I don't trust it....

I did have one race RT's were good earlier this year

Why do they put Bronze guides in Aluminum heads with steel valves? Because the steel will gall the aluminum and start sticking or wearing. Steel on steel or steel in a bronze sleeve or bushing will work. Some Aluminum alloys are better than others but still not optimum.
With the high pressure of the transmission fluid you may never have problems with the steel rod in the aluminum but I do think it would be better to have a steel or Bronze sleeve there. IMHO.

I looked into the aluminum valve body when we were all talking about them a while back and I thought then it did not sound very good. The steel rod in an aluminum bore was a red flag to me. At that time I decided not worth the time, money or potential problem and did not do it. The mixed reviews here reinforce my thoughts on them.

As a o.e. trans builder by occupation, I see wore out aluminum valvebodies in 90% of what we re build. Sonnax makes replacement, oversized valves for all makes because all the o.e. put steel valves in aluminum valvebodies without any kind of sleeving. The valvebodies in these cars work great UNTIL something comes apart, like a torque converter or planetary and then you have a valvebody that is junk unless you reem and put oversized valves in it. This is the only reason i am not a fan of the aluminum valvebody.

Sonnax does an excellent job on coming out with updates on most kits to correct OE flaws and there are thousands. Aluminum VB"s You Can keep em. I have a friend that has a trans franchise. The junk man loves him. Unless it's a stainless barrel kit. Just get on Sonnax's mailer.

I am on vacation now and burned, looking like a lobster, but if memory serves me, we've been doing the billet vbs for PGs for almost a decade. We had done some new iron castings for several years, but they were a challenge to machine, and were extremely heavy when eliminating all of the unused channels for a race only valve body.

The first billet VB was likely Griner or maybe ATI (ATD had done cast ones before as well), but we've sold thousands since introducing the product. We considered putting sleeves in the bores. Early feedback from many asked this question, and I even had a Ford engineer recommend it when we went to Luke's expo in Detroit. Our position is that the cycle counts in the regulator and transbrake are so much lower than OEM requirements, combined with the testing results we saw from prototypes that installing sleeves wasn't needed for racing applications. Put 100,000 miles on your race car - than perhaps it may be reasonable. Our earliest prototypes are still in operation in the cars of Buddy Ferrell.

As Powerglides go 100% new parts, billet aluminum is the best choice for racing setups
- ease of machining, weight savings, and appearance. If you have access to OEM cores - they work fine, but the volume we require to meet our customers needs makes that choice impossible.

I'd also like to add that any transmission or converter failure that may damage an aluminum valve body can equally destroy a cast iron regulator bore - we've thrown away heaps of them.

quote:

Originally posted by Brandon@BTE:
I'd also like to add that any transmission or converter failure that may damage an aluminum valve body can equally destroy a cast iron regulator bore - we've thrown away heaps of them.

^^^This guy knows his stuff. Most racers lose their sheet when you tell them they have to replace a 500-700 valvebody.

Again, there is no issue with the BTE billet valve body and it has provided quicker reaction times and a smaller window of variance in reaction times.

I worked on my Coan Aluminum VB last night for a while. Trans is on the floor so it's easy...

Installed in trans with enclosed solenoid also installed. Energize solenoid and it drives the steel valve into the VB so hard it sticks.

Exactly what happened the first time I ran the car earlier this year. Fluid pressure and some warmth eventually free-ed it up and it never stuck again at any race I went to.

I certainly should have sent it back to Coan but feel like I can fix it myself and will.

I bought it in Dec. 2020

I agree with Brandon on the cycles being very low in what we do and wear probably not being an issue.

I will get it to work without sticking or binding and it will be in my spare trans for now.

At a race earlier this year I had 4 successive Rt's within about .005"

quote:

Originally posted by SCDIV1:
I worked on my Coan Aluminum VB last night for a while. Trans is on the floor so it's easy...

Installed in trans with enclosed solenoid also installed. Energize solenoid and it drives the steel valve into the VB so hard it sticks.

Exactly what happened the first time I ran the car earlier this year. Fluid pressure and some warmth eventually free-ed it up and it never stuck again at any race I went to.

I certainly should have sent it back to Coan but feel like I can fix it myself and will.

I bought it in Dec. 2020

I agree with Brandon on the cycles being very low in what we do and wear probably not being an issue.

I will get it to work without sticking or binding and it will be in my spare trans for now.

My FTI did that exact thing when I changed the solenoid once, you need to shim the solenoid back with some gaskets, I think I ended up with 4 or 5 gaskets to get it to stop going in to far

I thought ATI was the first. Called it wicked quick I think. I got one of the first and after several install and not working,send back, do it, once more, they sent me a new one several years ago and I have never used it. It has a manufacture date on it. I am not going to kick a sleeping dog and the cast one that is in there works well.