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DRR Pro
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The Next New MSD Grid Modules

MSD has a new MSDView4 software upgrade (4.3.33) that contains version Beta 4.3.36. of the software.

This latest version installs the new 7766 NTK Wide Band O2 Module and 7767 Exhaust Pressure Module sample files. It also contains Bug Fixes and Improved Stability.
 
Posts: 2416 | Location: 53056 | Registered: December 30, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of TomR
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Still no driveshaft counter data acquisition (unless you have the 7761 ARC module)

I would love to be able to compare engine rpm vs driveshaft rpm without having to purchase a racepak.

Maybe one day, but I doubt it. In their eyes, they already have a solution. Too bad it is illegal for our type of racing.

(For the record, I'm against using slew rates in bracket racing)


72 Nova "Hooptie"
 
Posts: 729 | Location: Hanover, MD | Registered: June 20, 2016Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
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I agree Tom, and have written MSD several times about this, but I believe my letters ended up in the round file at the end of the desk.

I did start a thread several years ago HERE about this subject and keep it in view of all on MSD website.
 
Posts: 2416 | Location: 53056 | Registered: December 30, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
Picture of DaleH
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Maybe they are concerned about the perception of performing something similar to slew but without the 7761 thus making the Grid illegal or unmarketable to bracket racers?

Just a thought?
 
Posts: 61 | Location: MN | Registered: August 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of David Covey
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quote:
Originally posted by Tom Reyer:
Still no driveshaft counter data acquisition (unless you have the 7761 ARC module)

I would love to be able to compare engine rpm vs driveshaft rpm without having to purchase a racepak.

Maybe one day, but I doubt it. In their eyes, they already have a solution. Too bad it is illegal for our type of racing.

(For the record, I'm against using slew rates in bracket racing)


If that's all you want then an Autometer dual channel playback tach will get you there.
Tach

Or go with the Ultimate DL tach and get 4 channels.
•Dual-Channel Playback
•Data Pro Software
•Pressure & Wideband Air-Fuel Ratio Compatibility

Ultimate DL Tach

Dave


"It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell
 
Posts: 3300 | Location: American By Birth Texan By The Grace Of God  | Registered: April 29, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of TomR
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quote:
Originally posted by David Covey:


If that's all you want then an Autometer dual channel playback tach will get you there.
Tach

Or go with the Ultimate DL tach and get 4 channels.
•Dual-Channel Playback
•Data Pro Software
•Pressure & Wideband Air-Fuel Ratio Compatibility

Ultimate DL Tach

Dave


Thanks for the info, I already have the grid ignition, two O2 sensors and the grid power module on my car. Just hoping for a plug n play DS counter for data acquisition some day. My car was acting funny and was inconsistent, moving .04 in the 60ft. I could see the RPM acting up on launch but never felt it spin. Replaced the tires, no change, then the converter.

Old converter.


New converter.


I would get the ARC just to record the DS speed but would be accused of cheating and have to deal with all the BS that comes along with it. It's bad enough now with some people, they already think you are cheating just by having the grid ignition.


72 Nova "Hooptie"
 
Posts: 729 | Location: Hanover, MD | Registered: June 20, 2016Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Rymo
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Whats the downfall of using an arc just for the DS? I know the answer but want clarity here. Mark, I'm assuming the issue is the runtime counter and I've heard it being 60min before the 7761 clears of the memory. Cody was speaking to this on Luke&Jeds Podcast once. But who's to say you cant have multiple grids to eliminate the history? I carry a spare red/black box. Is this possible? I'm thinking outloud here. I was thinking about this during a previous big money race when I saw tech happening later in the rounds. Whats to stop someone from just flat switching grids or any ignition in a plug and play method. Maybe another thread. I don't win enough to be accused Frown


Ryan Fasano

2014 Byron Overall Track Champion
Byron's actual elevation is 730' because that matters more than winning anything ever....
 
Posts: 535 | Location: wisconsin | Registered: January 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Pro
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If one wanted to use the 7761 ARC module and later compete in events not allowing this, it would be wise to have a separate 7730 Grid to interchange with the ARC. Nothing dishonest about using this method.

Once the Slew Module Timeout has been set to 60 minutes in 7730 Grid, it will take that long of the ignition running to set this value back to 00.

I believe it takes someone experienced enough like a Cody to find out if someone is using an illegal ignition device in competition.

Personally, I feel that even using one of these devices “legally” will not have an advantage over the present competition in big money bracket racing.
 
Posts: 2416 | Location: 53056 | Registered: December 30, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Rymo
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I can personally attest to that as my own car and many others can be very very good. I was just playing devils advocate. Can you adjust the slew module timing? The default is 60 but can u move this?


Ryan Fasano

2014 Byron Overall Track Champion
Byron's actual elevation is 730' because that matters more than winning anything ever....
 
Posts: 535 | Location: wisconsin | Registered: January 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of David Covey
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quote:
Originally posted by markemark:



I believe it takes someone experienced enough like a Cody to find out if someone is using an illegal ignition device in competition.

Personally, I feel that even using one of these devices “legally” will not have an advantage over the present competition in big money bracket racing.


There is a device produced by MSD that connects to the data port of the grid that allows tech to see everything connected to the grid. Joel (IHRA Div 4)showed it to me at Baton Rouge. He seemed so proud..lol

Not saying every Division tech trailer has one. But I would think so.

I do agree with you that I see nothing wrong with using them. Everyone in the electronics class can pretty much repeat run to run, and it's still a dial it class.
Until they come up with something that can make the car perfect run after run and also control the tree, humans still have to figure it out and then make it happen perfect every time.. They still haven't developed anything that makes luck on the winners side.

Dave


"It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell
 
Posts: 3300 | Location: American By Birth Texan By The Grace Of God  | Registered: April 29, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Rymo
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I'm saying, remove the grids prior to the later rounds... this would eliminate that tool being useful


Ryan Fasano

2014 Byron Overall Track Champion
Byron's actual elevation is 730' because that matters more than winning anything ever....
 
Posts: 535 | Location: wisconsin | Registered: January 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of David Covey
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quote:
Originally posted by Rymo:
I'm saying, remove the grids prior to the later rounds... this would eliminate that tool being useful


Agree, I'm just saying there is something out there that tech can use to can see what is hooked to the grid.

Naturally if you change the ignition to one that never had anything else installed the tool couldn't see it..

Dave


"It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell
 
Posts: 3300 | Location: American By Birth Texan By The Grace Of God  | Registered: April 29, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of Richard Hammond
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quote:
Originally posted by Rymo:
I'm saying, remove the grids prior to the later rounds... this would eliminate that tool being useful


And replace them with what? A distributor with points and a condenser.
 
Posts: 433 | Location: miami | Registered: September 07, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Rymo
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I was thinking a hamster..... no, you can have 2 grids, or 10 with all the same program in it for your car, run in the first 5 rounds with whatever you want plugged in, then round 6 you put a different grid in it, plug and play in about 1 min and continue with no trace. I'm just saying....


Ryan Fasano

2014 Byron Overall Track Champion
Byron's actual elevation is 730' because that matters more than winning anything ever....
 
Posts: 535 | Location: wisconsin | Registered: January 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Sportsman
Picture of Richard Hammond
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quote:
Originally posted by Rymo:
I was thinking a hamster..... no, you can have 2 grids, or 10 with all the same program in it for your car, run in the first 5 rounds with whatever you want plugged in, then round 6 you put a different grid in it, plug and play in about 1 min and continue with no trace. I'm just saying....


I get what you are saying. You could always check cars at both ends of the track too. Tech them at the head of staging and at then again at the ticket booth. Automatic DQ if you don't stop for tech after whatever round.
 
Posts: 433 | Location: miami | Registered: September 07, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
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MSD Grid is very easy to police visually imho and here’s why.

If there is no CAN-bus hub attached to the 6-pin CAN-bus cable then 7761 cannot be used. And if the White wire “Points IN” is not attached to anything, then aftermarket controls are not being used.

Same goes for any analog MSD product. If the White points in wire is loose and not connected then this would indicate that an aftermarket control is not being used.

Here’s a better question. If you have a Holly Dominator EFI control whether running EFI or carb what do you plug in to police this?? Maybe Mike Beck could give us some insight on this.
 
Posts: 2416 | Location: 53056 | Registered: December 30, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of TomR
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Rymo:
I was thinking a hamster..... no, you can have 2 grids, or 10 with all the same program in it for your car, run in the first 5 rounds with whatever you want plugged in, then round 6 you put a different grid in it, plug and play in about 1 min and continue with no trace. I'm just saying....


That doesn't make much sense to me. A person uses the illegal ARC module, then 6th round, swaps out the grid and removes the ARC module and has no clue where or what to dial? Seems like a sure fire way to lose 6th round to me.

Here is my cheating question:

What's to keep someone from wiring up say, 2 grids, one open and easy to access for tech and one hidden with any and all cheating stuff attached? Tech plugs in to the easy access one and sees no slew rates, good to go.


72 Nova "Hooptie"
 
Posts: 729 | Location: Hanover, MD | Registered: June 20, 2016Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Rymo
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Tom I was just raising the question. I think you'd have to hold some or have done it a few times to know what your car would run, but your deep into the money rounds and justified by taking that chance IMO. Mark and I have both said we think cars these days just flat don't need to cheat to be .00 and dead something. To your second point, yes you could run 2 and flip them over, they could trace wiring I suppose and some guys just flat know where to look. I didn't mean to turn this into a cheat thread, but with the ARC and GRID it seems we need to clarify everything so people understand whats its capable of and what to look for.


Ryan Fasano

2014 Byron Overall Track Champion
Byron's actual elevation is 730' because that matters more than winning anything ever....
 
Posts: 535 | Location: wisconsin | Registered: January 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Elite
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I have never, and suspect I never will, read anything by anyone who has used the slew control to gain consistency. I don't know how effective it is for that purpose. Does it get you within .02? That's not really helpful.
With all the paranoia about cheating, it would just about make sense to just legalize everything in box, and then nobody could be cheating, because it all is legal. Then it would just be cutting a great light, tuning the car with the tools we are talking about, and minor adjustments at the finish line. Of course you will never convince some people they aren't being cheated.


Foxtrot Juliet Bravo
 
Posts: 6339 | Location: Illinois | Registered: July 08, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Rymo
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With how good everything is these days i honestly dont feel anyone is. I put my helmet on thinking im racing someone fair and square, call me nieve but im ok with it. I know these cars can be great without so i dont feel the need. I feel if anything the most gain is in the reaction time category for no box. If u could do something there i think u could leave the performance aspects of the cars alone because they are too good.


Ryan Fasano

2014 Byron Overall Track Champion
Byron's actual elevation is 730' because that matters more than winning anything ever....
 
Posts: 535 | Location: wisconsin | Registered: January 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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