I could care less, really...I'll say this, when I tow a good bit I am damn sure glad to have a buy back if I screw up early...I am not a big fan of towing 6 hours or more and going home after a couple of timeshots and the first round...

quote:

Originally posted by head gamez:

quote:

Originally posted by Curly1:
If you do not like buybacks then simply do not buyback or go race some place that you like better.

Not buying back doesn't solve the issue for people that don't like buy backs. It is simple enough to think that way though.

If a person doesn't like buy backs and wins first (and second round) then they are still a victim of buy backs by an increase in the rounds needed to win or get to "the money". Or, perhaps they are beat in a later round by someone that did buy back.

quote:

Go race some place that you like better

Tell that to a guy with 1 track within a 3+ hour drive. No impact... right?



For the record, I don't mind them.... but your simple approach to other people's issues with them is dumb at best.

There are no victims in this sport. We own every round we win or lose. Got beat by a great package? Do better!
Plus, even those who do not like buy backs are subject to their benefits when they win and enjoy the larger advertised payouts that are possible because of the buybacks.

Some want to debate this to death. But the FACTS of the matter are:
1. Racers demand higher advertised payouts to attract them to a particular race
2. To get these payouts, promoters/tracks need higher car counts and extra opportunities to increase revenue if they are to turn a profit.
3. The majority of traveling racers....who are needed for that higher payout....prefer the option of buying back.

So those who hate buybacks can stomp their feet, kick dirt and refuse to race at races that offer them. But they are fighting against basically the rest of the people in the sport, who are simply paying their money and supporting the race. I totally understand and respect standing tough with one's principles. But there is also a place for practicality at times and understanding the entire situation. I LIKE races that pay more round money at the expense of big advertised win money. But that doesn't get racers in the gate. And I understand that. So I have the choice of kicking dirt or going racing each time.

This can kind of be looked at as a glass half full vs half empty mentality. Are buybacks another opportunity for someone to beat you? Or is it another round of racing for you to prove you are better than others? I always figure that the first round losers are statistically less likely to beat me if I won the first round. If you look at bracket racing strictly as a game of chance (and there is some of that) then really it is another chance to get beat. But if you look at it as you just having to be better than the guy in the other lane x number of times, then another round of racing....even if it is against some of the same people you saw earlier in the day getting beat....is just another chance to prove yourself.
I generally don't think about the day as trying to win the event. I think about winning the next round. And I just have to keep winning the next round over and over.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Bucky,

Going back to my earlier example of a local track that has two rounds of buybacks....

Each round of time trials takes minimum of one hour, and now the two buy back rounds take an hour each. So if everything goes smoothly (no oil downs, etc) it is now 4-5 hours from beginning of first time run to get to the point where we start eliminating cars. So if I arrive at the gate one hour before time trials, it's 5-6 hours before eliminations really start? NO THANK YOU.

I enjoy the pressure and the rush that comes with running without a safety net. Tow 10 hours to a divisional, been there all weekend, first round coming up with no time trial on the day and no buybacks. That's the good stuff!

I used to feel that way before first round every time I went racing, 20 years ago. I don't anymore, and I miss it.

quote:

Originally posted by SlyFox:
Going back to my earlier example of a local track that has two rounds of buybacks....

Each round of time trials takes minimum of one hour, and now the two buy back rounds take an hour each. So if everything goes smoothly (no oil downs, etc) it is now 4-5 hours from beginning of first time run to get to the point where we start eliminating cars. So if I arrive at the gate one hour before time trials, it's 5-6 hours before eliminations really start? NO THANK YOU.

It seems as though one of two things is at play there:
1. You have great car count already. IMO that ought to mean 2 time trials and one round of buy backs are in order. No more of either.
2. The track is running the program very inefficiently.

And I don't blame you on the time. I only have so many hours in me for being a decent racer per day. But then our track Starts TT's I think at 2, and eliminations generally have been starting at 7. Our car counts have fallen, and generally they can start elim's earlier than 7 now. We have a lot of classes still. We run them all including jr's on the same day. Some days we also have quick 16 races in addition. So really, the time does add up pretty quickly. Probably 6 classes can add up to well over an hour per time trial even with moderate car counts if they aren't right on top of their efficiency.

quote:

Originally posted by Tom396:

quote:

Originally posted by J178RED:

This is deadon... I HATE BUY BACKS! Should have t-shirts made with that ....hahaha

No b*yback T-shirts

I own several of these T-shirts, in different colors, and a couple of the sweatshirts. This is from Michael Beard's site (Staging Light). Take care. Tom Worthington

That's great, I hope to get one for Christmas....hahaha

Can’t win em all if you don’t win the first one

quote:

Originally posted by rooster_439:
Can’t win em all if you don’t win the first one

Well at least 2nd or 3rd depending.

I heard that the Guru of bracket racing at Capitol Raceway at one time had 3 rounds of buybacks at his top eliminator only experiment which didn't last long.

I also hate the buyback. Now I'm on the board of directors of our local track. Without the buyback we would probably have to close the doors.

Bracket racing back east where there are great car counts is one thing. Bracket racing out here without the good car counts is slowly dying.

Them's the facts folks. We have to make it on the Friday night T&T crowd or by having a "show" where we can draw enough spectators to pay the bills.

Got any ideas to help us? Please let me know, I'll be glad to listen but the fact of the matter is local bracket racing is dying. And I hate that!!