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DRR S/Pro
Picture of wideopen231
posted
Well with not being able to run car I am at least getting some new parts. Already have new rods in ol' gal since the others where out of my TA/D combo.

Next on the peace of mind parts list is lifters.The one in engine now are Comp Cams design from late 90's. Hell we broke few of them back then.

Wondering what most are running and thoughts on them. Although my Hemi is not apples to apples w/bbc most run quality is quality in most cases. While not turning 10k at shifts like Top Alcohol cars they are my only other source of reference on whats working and while my be to extreme nobody ever got hurt by stronger than needed parts.

So what you running? How many runs.? What rpm range?Cost while not entirely base of decision it helps in comparison with some I am looking at.



//www.schooledbyscotty.com
God so loved America he sent Donald Trump to save it from the democrats.

I use to be anti social ,now I am concerned citizen
Chris McBride

America home of free.Brought to you by 2nd amendment.
 
Posts: 1704 | Location: Greensboro NC | Registered: May 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
posted Hide Post
Isky ezroll Max here. 75-7600rpm. My first set went 323 runs before a broken spring beat up the lobe and bushing.


Denis LeBlanc

 
Posts: 209 | Location: Manchester, NH | Registered: February 03, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of David Covey
posted Hide Post
Chris,

Go to the Crower web site and download the catalog. They have different lifters listed that show recommended spring pressure (min/max). Although I will tell you everyone recommends not to restrict oiling. This is the issue you and I have because we are using a block that has no provision for lifter oiling.
When I talked to their tech dept and mentioned this he recommended going with a lifter that would handle the over the nose pressure of the spring..
Other than sending a block to a machinist that would be capable of drilling the oil passage through the block or doing as you suggested to putting an external oiling system on there Crowers suggestion is the one I would go with..

After breaking a set of lifters 3 of the last 5 seasons, if these crowers don't hold up I'm going to think hard about going to a 1 1/16 in lifter..

Dave

DC: I have 3 incomplete sets of sets of comps, 1 incomplete set of bushed.


"Participating in a gun buyback program because you think that criminals have too many guns is like having yourself castrated because you think your neighbors have too many kids."

-Clint Eastwood
 
Posts: 2709 | Location: American By Birth Texan By The Grace Of God  | Registered: April 29, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of wideopen231
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David,
The oiling issue is one I should have pointed out in OP. My bad.

Morels are at top of wish list since lots of TA teams run them and they have same oiling as we do. Wish list because cost is steep($1015 at Wizzards warehouse),but maybe cheap in long run. Crowers are on list of possible choices too. Hoping to find something besides Morels that will last good while.

Remember the conversations about rocker oiling. I think the extra oil provided by the spray system will help here. It has to drain back either thru returns or top of heads to galley.It is aimed towards galley side and hard to see how it can not be beneficial here too. I know extra oil on top side cost HP but then so does busted lifters. LOL Not to mention cash cost part of that.

Guess I know where stimulus check can go towards. Hey the dems are helping me buy parts. Well that or parts for new AR 10 I am building also. LMAO

This message has been edited. Last edited by: wideopen231,



//www.schooledbyscotty.com
God so loved America he sent Donald Trump to save it from the democrats.

I use to be anti social ,now I am concerned citizen
Chris McBride

America home of free.Brought to you by 2nd amendment.
 
Posts: 1704 | Location: Greensboro NC | Registered: May 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of TD3550
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Me personally, i have had no problems with the Morel Ultra's.
 
Posts: 652 | Location: Under a Truck | Registered: August 23, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of Mike Rietow
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This is a set of Morel needles, we'll be all over these checking for any hint of failure per run, with a camshaft just shy an inch of lift, and open spring pressures above 1400. We're gonna find out. Hoping to get 50 runs out of these, Jesel roller lifters are next, hopefully before any carnage $$$.



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1996, 1998, 2001, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2008 Super Pro Champion Sunshine Dragstrip, Clearwater Florida
 
Posts: 1249 | Location: Madeira Beach Fl. | Registered: June 12, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
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BAM...
 
Posts: 573 | Location: USA | Registered: December 04, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Trophy
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Roller lifters are made of many individual pieces, the material specification and the Quality Control for each individual piece is what determines the service and superiority of the Lifter..The more control the manufacturer has over the dimensional machining,materials,and the heat treating of the load bearing components the longer the lifter life. There has to be consistency in all of these areas to continually produce a quality product...Nearly ALL of the Major lifter makers have produced good lifters in the beginning of their production releases, and most have experienced some breakdown in Quality Control which is the reason we continue to see"Who has the Best" lifter threads..For Us Jesel has clearly been the BEST.....It is also important to recognize how important proper clearance of the lifter to bore,proper valve spring and quality lubrication is to lifter service life..
 
Posts: 152 | Location: North Royalton Ohio US*** | Registered: January 08, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of Mike Rietow
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by S/S Dart:
Roller lifters are made of many individual pieces, the material specification and the Quality Control for each individual piece is what determines the service and superiority of the Lifter..The more control the manufacturer has over the dimensional machining,materials,and the heat treating of the load bearing components the longer the lifter life. There has to be consistency in all of these areas to continually produce a quality product...Nearly ALL of the Major lifter makers have produced good lifters in the beginning of their production releases, and most have experienced some breakdown in Quality Control which is the reason we continue to see"Who has the Best" lifter threads..For Us Jesel has clearly been the BEST.....It is also important to recognize how important proper clearance of the lifter to bore,proper valve spring and quality lubrication is to lifter service life..


Good to know, thanks for your input.


https://youtu.be/FZ6zwnyDwUg

http://ottm.store

https://youtu.be/I8QWEaqeFRw

1996, 1998, 2001, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2008 Super Pro Champion Sunshine Dragstrip, Clearwater Florida
 
Posts: 1249 | Location: Madeira Beach Fl. | Registered: June 12, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of DRB Motorsports
posted Hide Post
BAM x 2


Michael Frizie
ET 2471
2011 Diamond Chassis Dragster
 
Posts: 350 | Location: Winston, GA | Registered: April 10, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
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Most here are shoe polish racing. I understand the want to go faster scenario but do you really need an inch of lift and 1400 pounds of spring pressure? Wow! Maybe it's for some class racing, I don't know but I'll keep running stuff that's a little easier on the valve train.


Clowns to the left of me, Jokers to the right. Here I am.......
 
Posts: 4649 | Location: stuck in the middle with you! | Registered: March 11, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by wideopen231:
David,
The oiling issue is one I should have pointed out in OP. My bad.

Morels are at top of wish list since lots of TA teams run them and they have same oiling as we do. Wish list because cost is steep($1015 at Wizzards warehouse),but maybe cheap in long run. Crowers are on list of possible choices too. Hoping to find something besides Morels that will last good while.

Remember the conversations about rocker oiling. I think the extra oil provided by the spray system will help here. It has to drain back either thru returns or top of heads to galley.It is aimed towards galley side and hard to see how it can not be beneficial here too. I know extra oil on top side cost HP but then so does busted lifters. LOL Not to mention cash cost part of that.

Guess I know where stimulus check can go towards. Hey the dems are helping me buy parts. Well that or parts for new AR 10 I am building also. LMAO


Isky did some early testing on motors like yours that relied on splash oiling only on their red zone bushed lifters! After a season of running they were sent back for inspection. They worked great btw.
 
Posts: 1258 | Location: Tewksbury, MA,USA | Registered: November 03, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of David Covey
posted Hide Post
I have broken comp lifters almost as fast as I installed them it seems, I had used crane years ago and never broke them, replaced out of guilt. Believe it or not my first set of rollers were Doug Herbert, bought cam lifters and springs from them. Used those for 10 years at least and never hurt any, course it was a small cam by today's standards. It still pushed a 2800 lb SST car to off the stop 9.90 ET's.
Now I've moved to Crower their middle of the pack lifter shows it more than capable of handling my cam and spring combo.

As I was saying in my response to Chris our KB blocks do not have the oil passage to the lifters, therefor they do not have pressurized oiling to the lifter axle, splash only. Like an idiot when I ordered my Indy Max block I told them it was a solid roller so they didn't drill the oil passage in it either. Of course at that time I did not have lifter issues.
Now of course I have the knowledge to insist on having the oiling.

What's sorta funny though is on a stock mopar block one of the things we always done was to restrict the oil to the lifter galley.

Has anyone measured the dimension of the axle in a needle roller vs a bushed roller?

As a FYI my last set of Comp bushed lifters didn't break the roller. A tie bar came loose on #1 cyl and bounced back to #8 which caused the tie bar ear to break taking out two sets of rollers.. Knowing what I know now I would tack weld the stupid tie bar screw so it could not come out.

Dave


"Participating in a gun buyback program because you think that criminals have too many guns is like having yourself castrated because you think your neighbors have too many kids."

-Clint Eastwood
 
Posts: 2709 | Location: American By Birth Texan By The Grace Of God  | Registered: April 29, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of David Covey
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Chris,

The return oiling from the head will not do any good as I don't think it can get to the roller from the top. Although it will create a ton of windage to splash oil the rollers..lol Eek

I'm adding 4 oil return lines from the head back into the pan.

Dave


"Participating in a gun buyback program because you think that criminals have too many guns is like having yourself castrated because you think your neighbors have too many kids."

-Clint Eastwood
 
Posts: 2709 | Location: American By Birth Texan By The Grace Of God  | Registered: April 29, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR S/Pro
Picture of David Covey
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:


Isky did some early testing on motors like yours that relied on splash oiling only on their red zone bushed lifters! After a season of running they were sent back for inspection. They worked great btw.


Did they mention the cam and spring specifications?

Dave


"Participating in a gun buyback program because you think that criminals have too many guns is like having yourself castrated because you think your neighbors have too many kids."

-Clint Eastwood
 
Posts: 2709 | Location: American By Birth Texan By The Grace Of God  | Registered: April 29, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of Mike Rietow
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Cashflow:
Most here are shoe polish racing. I understand the want to go faster scenario but do you really need an inch of lift and 1400 pounds of spring pressure? Wow! Maybe it's for some class racing, I don't know but I'll keep running stuff that's a little easier on the valve train.


It's a mild build in the radial tire world. BES top end ALL Pro Raised runner 23 sbc. This isn't mine, I do the engine, transmission and suspension. Radial tire racing pretty much rose to where it's at out of Sunshine Dragstrip in Clearwater Florida starting back in the early 2000's, so I've always stayed fairly busy doing engines and transmissions for various people. This is a mild build in comparison. Make no mistake though these cars rock n roll on a small tire. It's pretty interesting and allows for high level learning. This particular engine is owned by a working man, he's been patient in rounding the bread/parts up over 3-4 years. Definitely has a nice piece I'd like to get jesel lifters in asap, but for now at least we have the correct rocker arms on it. We'll be all over these morel lifters every run looking for any hint of failure in the mean time.

We just reconfigured it for the new DXP Street class limited to 4150 cast base carb, 4150 intake and 300hp NOS cheater plate. 3000 lb car 275 dot radial. It'll run in the 4's off the trailer crossing around 140 - 8500 rpm.



This message has been edited. Last edited by: Mike Rietow,


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1996, 1998, 2001, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2008 Super Pro Champion Sunshine Dragstrip, Clearwater Florida
 
Posts: 1249 | Location: Madeira Beach Fl. | Registered: June 12, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Top Comp
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Okay, I get it now. Like I said, for Stupid Comp I'll just keep my easy on stuff parts.


Clowns to the left of me, Jokers to the right. Here I am.......
 
Posts: 4649 | Location: stuck in the middle with you! | Registered: March 11, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by David Covey:
quote:
Originally posted by TOP38:


Isky did some early testing on motors like yours that relied on splash oiling only on their red zone bushed lifters! After a season of running they were sent back for inspection. They worked great btw.


Did they mention the cam and spring specifications?

Dave


Try to get in touch with Ron Isky, it was a blown deal as I remembered. I believe he just works part time these days
 
Posts: 1258 | Location: Tewksbury, MA,USA | Registered: November 03, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of C Hodge
posted Hide Post
I wouldn’t put Morels in my lawnmower. My 12 degree motor went 22 passes before a lifter went. I saw the lifters out of an 18 degree 632 Morel needless that the pin is a brass bushing and never made a pass before it bent in the first burnout. I had good luck with Crower and Isky in my 632 and the crowers in my SB have great
 
Posts: 153 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: December 18, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR S/Pro
Picture of wideopen231
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by David Covey:
Chris,

The return oiling from the head will not do any good as I don't think it can get to the roller from the top. Although it will create a ton of windage to splash oil the rollers..lol Eek

I'm adding 4 oil return lines from the head back into the pan.

Dave

I have 3 number 8 lines for return to pan now.
Right rear had zero room to get in.



//www.schooledbyscotty.com
God so loved America he sent Donald Trump to save it from the democrats.

I use to be anti social ,now I am concerned citizen
Chris McBride

America home of free.Brought to you by 2nd amendment.
 
Posts: 1704 | Location: Greensboro NC | Registered: May 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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