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Wiring question for Ohio Mafia
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DRR Sportsman
Picture of novaX522
posted
I'm planning to do some rewiring on the racecar this winter. I'm leaning towards going with the ARC touch pad switches and relay board. I think I read that you have had good luck with their products. I'm trying to come up with a layout that looks nice and is easy to work on. I was wondering if you could give a rookie a few pointers. What do you use to land all the ground wires on that looks clean and provides a good ground? I currently have 1/O cable from battery to a bolt that goes through firewall. I have multiple grounds running to it, and it's getting a little crowded. I also recently installed a grid and left the wires full length and landed them on wire blocks. Wondered if you would be willing to share how to make that mess of wires look nice. Thanks, Rob Livingston.


Rob Livingston
 
Posts: 190 | Location: Waterloo, Iowa | Registered: July 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
Picture of Maxx Levell
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In for the class Smile... I have to say that my wiring is a total mess at the moment...as I left the Grid wires uncut as well and just temporarily mounted it until I get a gameplan together for the wiring layout. Would love to hear any tips as well.


Maxx Levell

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Posts: 75 | Location: Henderson, KY | Registered: July 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of McK_Racing
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The wiring on my car is a mess, but the one good thing I ever did was install a Shogun "Ground-it" block. It has two large 3/8" lugs for the battery/engine ground cables, and a bunch of smaller lugs for the rest of the grounds. Bolting it to the sheet metal also helps ground the body. I know Shogun isn't in business anymore, but maybe you could find one (or something like it) used. With all the lugs to use, you'd never run out, and being in a row, you could make the ground wires nice and tidy.
 
Posts: 292 | Location: Northern Hemisphere | Registered: February 23, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of Slick Vic
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Time and Patience! Plan, Plan, and Plan. I am usually going in after someone and trying to make the rats nest look clean because we are adding one item to an existing car. I have installed the ARC module several times, it is nice, just be careful with the ribbon cable. Most of the time i add an additional small fuse block with it for random items, interior lights, delay box, horn, etc. As far as grounds go, ive seen cars done lots of ways. Several welded studs to the frame, or like you are asking one spot to bring everything to. You can get terminal boards with one large stud and several small connection points in red or black, and they can make a wiring job cleaner. When laying out wiring use Velcro to organize them until its time to finish, i then use tie wraps and coverage material if customer wants.


302-786-1078
slickvic@slickvicracing.com

slickvic@slickvicracing.com
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Dealer for most major brands, including Simpson, Necksgen, Hans, Strange, Moser, Amsoil, Aerospace, Digital Delay, Hoosier, M/T, Goodyear, Redhorse, MSD, Racepak, Lucas, and more.

Complete racecar wiring and custom CNC parts available.
 
Posts: 75 | Location: Delaware | Registered: June 12, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR All Star
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quote:
Originally posted by McK_Racing:
The wiring on my car is a mess, but the one good thing I ever did was install a Shogun "Ground-it" block. It has two large 3/8" lugs for the battery/engine ground cables, and a bunch of smaller lugs for the rest of the grounds. Bolting it to the sheet metal also helps ground the body. I know Shogun isn't in business anymore, but maybe you could find one (or something like it) used. With all the lugs to use, you'd never run out, and being in a row, you could make the ground wires nice and tidy.

I use one of those. I like it.


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Posts: 3622 | Location: Illinois | Registered: July 08, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR All Star
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Let me throw in there: How do you like to make a run of wires clean and neat? A bundle if you like. There are several products for keeping a bundle together and protected. Some make it difficult to let one wire escape along the route without making it look like a mess.


Does your party represent personal responsibility?
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Posts: 3622 | Location: Illinois | Registered: July 08, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
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Great questions...I've tried several times to answer this, and it's truly hard to do because as Vic mentioned, it is very much Time, Patience, and a little OCD.

I love the ARC products. One of the best products out there because you get the ease of a single cable from the switch panel to the relay board, a pre-built relay board, replaceable relays (unlike all others) and they have a lifetime warranty. The only con I can come up with is the ribbon cable...you have to be very careful when you wire tie this to the cage.

As far as grounding points...I use an insulated bulkhead feed through for power and ground. Gives you power and ground on both sides of the firewall and I use a dedicated ground cable directly from the battery...and yes, it does get very busy on the ground point so you just have to get creative when stacking them to keep it looking nice.

The Grid...In the past I have also just landed all the wires to a terminal block, but in more recent wiring installs I am wiring them to Deutsch connectors and only pinning the car side for what is needed at that time...if the customer wants to add to it later, he just needs to pin a new wire and go. What I am doing here is pinning this to mate to a Digital 7. If a racer ever decides to get rid of the Grid, a Digital 7 will plug right in or you can wire a 6 or 7 AL to the plug. Jegs sells the adaptor harnesses to do this, or as I do, make it yourself for a fraction of the price.

Also, As Vic pointed out...most of the time I have to add a second fuse block for such things as the line lock, trans brake, delay box, etc...by far the best product out there comes from Leash electronics. His Big Dog fuse block is $15 and is billet aluminum.

I'll post a few pics below to get your mind thinking...it truly does begin with planning and the layout. You have to envision where the wires need to go, where they need to turn or terminate and determine in what order. I haven't bought in to the Velcro deal yet...I still use wire ties and "layer wires"...I may grab 5 or 6 wires that all go to the same area, tie them together from A to B....then go back with an addition 5 or 6 wire and wire tie them to the original 5 or 6 and turn them off to the area they need to go. So yes, I zip tie them and then go right back in and cut them....but there is a method to that as well...As I add the second layer, I will cut the first three zip ties, add the new wires and 1 zip tie, cut the next zip tie, and then add one....from A to B. LOL On last tip...when you bend wires, the inside wire is shorter than the outside...wire tie them through the bend, but once you do this, you cant bend them back or the it distorts the bundle.


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Posts: 692 | Location: Lebanon, OH | Registered: March 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
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quote:
Originally posted by Bucky:
Let me throw in there: How do you like to make a run of wires clean and neat? A bundle if you like. There are several products for keeping a bundle together and protected. Some make it difficult to let one wire escape along the route without making it look like a mess.


Sorry guys...I'm old school and buy zip ties by the 1000's. LOL

I do, however like the self closing braided loom. If wires pass through an unseen area, or an area I need the wire to be more protected, I will use this, OR if the customer wants the wires to "disappear" against black chassis and/or carpet.


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Posts: 692 | Location: Lebanon, OH | Registered: March 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
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Removable...






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Posts: 692 | Location: Lebanon, OH | Registered: March 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Trophy
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Very nice looking work Ohio!!

I too run the ARC panel and ran into a ribbon cable issue at a race this year. 1st ever problem with product since installation back in '09. Could not fix at the track so I have an extra cable now. ARC repaired the original cable for free but that doesn't help you at the track. So it's only like $30-$40 for extra cable and that's "insurance" worth having!!
 
Posts: 116 | Location: 2008 IHRA SSS No Box WC | Registered: June 23, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post



DRR Pro
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quote:
Originally posted by LIZZARD:
Very nice looking work Ohio!!

I too run the ARC panel and ran into a ribbon cable issue at a race this year. 1st ever problem with product since installation back in '09. Could not fix at the track so I have an extra cable now. ARC repaired the original cable for free but that doesn't help you at the track. So it's only like $30-$40 for extra cable and that's "insurance" worth having!!


I've pinched them with wire ties... Also, they do get bridle over time. I would love to see them go to a serial cable design.


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Posts: 692 | Location: Lebanon, OH | Registered: March 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR All Star
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Great answers! How do you attach a wire or wires to round tubing? I rely on wire ties, but at times that can get less neat looking too. Not sure if there are options.


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Posts: 3622 | Location: Illinois | Registered: July 08, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
Picture of Canted Valve
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quote:
Sorry guys...I'm old school and buy zip ties by the 1000's. LOL I do, however like the self closing braided loom.

I'm not one to be passing out wiring advise (so I won't). While I like the look of the wire ties I find it problematic running an additional wire(s) along the same run when the occasion arises. With convoluted tubing you can just slip the wire in and be done with it. Just my experience.



Illegitimi non carborundum
 
Posts: 1311 | Location: OKC, OK | Registered: February 15, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
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quote:
Originally posted by Bucky:
Great answers! How do you attach a wire or wires to round tubing? I rely on wire ties, but at times that can get less neat looking too. Not sure if there are options.


If my customer doesn't mind, I like to drill and tap for 10-32 crews and use clamps...see top pic. If they mind, its wire ties..and I hate that because it distorts the bundle. I would love to weld stand-offs to tie to...McIlvain Rsce Cars does this to their cars...the use tig wire and it slips in between wires...when you zip tie around it, it doesn't distort.


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Posts: 692 | Location: Lebanon, OH | Registered: March 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
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quote:
Originally posted by Canted Valve:
quote:
Sorry guys...I'm old school and buy zip ties by the 1000's. LOL I do, however like the self closing braided loom.

I'm not one to be passing out wiring advise (so I won't). While I like the look of the wire ties I find it problematic running an additional wire(s) along the same run when the occasion arises. With convoluted tubing you can just slip the wire in and be done with it. Just my experience.



This is why when a car is dropped off, I ask..."will you ever want to add to this?" I prefer to wire for all possible options...that way the customer doesn't have to. To each their own, but I usually cringe when I hear that a customer added to my work...LOL


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Posts: 692 | Location: Lebanon, OH | Registered: March 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR All Star
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No stopping the questions now!
Any slick ways for wiring along the seat area in a dragster? Seems like I have a lot of wires going through a small opening, and it may leave them open for damage from the seat.


Does your party represent personal responsibility?
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Posts: 3622 | Location: Illinois | Registered: July 08, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR All Star
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quote:
Originally posted by OhiomafiaWireGuy:
quote:
Originally posted by Canted Valve:
quote:
Sorry guys...I'm old school and buy zip ties by the 1000's. LOL I do, however like the self closing braided loom.

I'm not one to be passing out wiring advise (so I won't). While I like the look of the wire ties I find it problematic running an additional wire(s) along the same run when the occasion arises. With convoluted tubing you can just slip the wire in and be done with it. Just my experience.



This is why when a car is dropped off, I ask..."will you ever want to add to this?" I prefer to wire for all possible options...that way the customer doesn't have to. To each their own, but I usually cringe when I hear that a customer added to my work...LOL


Adding to my own work has caused more messes for me than anything else. It's never as nice as starting from scratch with a plan.


Does your party represent personal responsibility?
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Posts: 3622 | Location: Illinois | Registered: July 08, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Sportsman
Picture of novaX522
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Thank you very much for the replies! One more question, which wires do you like to keep separated for interference reasons?


Rob Livingston
 
Posts: 190 | Location: Waterloo, Iowa | Registered: July 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
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quote:
Originally posted by novaX522:
Thank you very much for the replies! One more question, which wires do you like to keep separated for interference reasons?


The honest answer...zero! But, with that said, I will make a small effort to keep the mag pick-up cable away form the others. When I say away...I will run it parallel up a frame rail about an inch away. If using wire clamps. I will share the whole, but use two clamps opposite of each other. In all my experience, I have never had an RFI issue, But I use quality products, make quality connections, and ground everything to a central grounding point with a dedicated cable to the battery.


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Posts: 692 | Location: Lebanon, OH | Registered: March 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
DRR Pro
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Bucky:
No stopping the questions now!
Any slick ways for wiring along the seat area in a dragster? Seems like I have a lot of wires going through a small opening, and it may leave them open for damage from the seat.


Not really. I hate this area. You just have to do the best you can...maybe put the self closing braided loom around it in that area...


Dykes & Strippers Custom Wiring
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CleanYourTrailer.com
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245" Harry Clack
399 inches of Horse Power Sales Power
1.031, 2.978, 4.640 at 147.47
 
Posts: 692 | Location: Lebanon, OH | Registered: March 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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