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Bracket Talk Bracket Talk Forum General Discussion - by FTI Gooseneck trailer skin crackingGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
| Gooseneck trailer skin cracking | Login/Join |
DRR S/Pro |
I've noticed several trailer build threads popping up, so I thought I'd pose this question for my own information and maybe provide some info to those guys. I have a 2006 50' Haulmark with living quarters. It has developed a crack in the outer skin at the upper front corner of the side cargo entrance. It has been there for several years and seems to have stopped growing. Also, when raising and lowering to hook up the siding flex's (oil cans). I'm thinking this flex is also going on where the crack has developed. The trailer is becoming uglier as time passes, so I plan to reskin it as time allows and plan to add a ton of additional bracing in the gooseneck area and around the side doors. A couple of questions: Where would you guy's look at adding bracing? Would you reskin using tape or screws? Thanks Dave "It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell | ||
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DRR Pro |
Not really gonna help you, but I own a Pace American 30ft Gooseneck, dual 6K axles, extra 6" tall. I have a 30ft TAG, one foot taller than normal, tri 6K axles. Well, the Gooseneck weighs 12K with my car in it, and the TAG weighs 10K with the same car PLUS a golf cart! So I don't know how much bracing Pace did on that Gooseneck, but boy is that sucker heavy! It was actually built incorrectly, they made it a 5th Wheel, I had ordered it as a Gooseneck. The dealer I bought it through paid about $500 for a GIANT adapter to go from that Pin to the Ball. I had that off once to set the ride height on the trailer, I bet it weighs 200lbs! | |||
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DRR Top Comp |
Bracing yes. The tape or screw thing has few opposing points. First off tape. Right stuff damn strong at 100 bucks per roll it should be. Looks great when done. PIA if ever have to repair a panel. 2 or 3 person job placing sheet of aluminum,get it right 1st time or oh shyt. Screws or rivets. Strong,cheaper,easier repair and less men needed to instal.More still not bad. Not as slick looking IMO. Very time consuming You are going to need good amount of drill bits if using rivets. They make some that you insert in to hole and hammer peg sticking out in to flare back side.The ones I would use if going rivets. Going to need a guide to get holes or screws perfectly aligned,not big deal for do it yourselfer like some here are you are included to clarify. Cracking part would concern me a lot and would differently add bracing to prevent. America home of free. Brought to you by 2nd amendment. | |||
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| DRR S/Pro |
Believe me I know about the rivet deal. I built this for a friend years ago. Special tool to hold skin flat so it would not wrinkle while I drilled and riveted. Well can't seem to get the picture to load...  Dave "It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell | |||
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| DRR S/Pro |
Damn, posted the link and then it showed up... Dave "It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell | |||
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DRR S/Pro |
David, I just went through this with my 05 48' Haulmark LQ. The cargo door would bind anytime the weight was on the gooseneck, when it was on the landing gear it was ok. The sides would also wrinkle when on the gooseneck. I could see the entire gooseneck over hang flex upwards when taking the weight off the landing gear. I went as far as measuring the amount of flex, it was moving 3/4"! After removing the diamond plate that covers the landing gear area I was shocked at the poor design of the whole main frame to gooseneck structure, the gusseting was not sufficient and the gauge of steel used for the entire gooseneck area was just too light, IMO. I was also planning on adding bracing, but decided it would be a huge undertaking so I traded it in on a new 48' Cargomate. The structure in the gooseneck area is a much better design and much more Stout. I checked the amount of flex of the gooseneck same as I did on the Haulmark, it moves less than 1/8". The other big difference in the two trailers is the main frame rails. The Haulmark had a single rectangular box down each side, the Cargomate has two I-beam main frame rails that are welded together down each side. I think that this is less prone the flexing that a single box frame rail. 272" Spitzer 540 Chevy The Blower Shop XR1 FTI XPM Series Converter FTI Level 6 Powerglide 3.69@199 .916 60' 2017 Bradenton Heads Up Madness Open Outlaw Champ 2018 PDRA T/D #5 2019 PDRA T/D #2 2020 Retired From T/D Competition.... 2020 Bradenton NMCA Hemi Shootout Winner 2021 getting back into bracket racing with a Gen3 Hemi powered 87 Cutlass. | |||
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DRR Sportsman |
Just a reminder be sure to get 49" wide panels when you reskin. | |||
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DRR Pro |
I had bought a vintage 2007 50 foot living quarters trailer new in 2007. In the 1st 6 months they had to remove the skin on the sides at the gooseneck and reweld and rebrace. The roads simply beat the chit out of these trailers and most are poorly structured with minimal materials used. The roofs catch hell and leak, the walls buckled quickly, the screws constantly falling out. I had the trailer 3 years, put 70,000 miles on it and considered it a POS and sold it cheap. The next guy had to replace floor inside of 2 years. In my opinion I would not reskin as you may have far more work on your hands when you get halfway in...get another trailer and save a ton of work and grief if at all possible. JMO | |||
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| DRR S/Pro |
I haven't taken the diamond plate off at the gooseneck, But the bracing is 1/4" plate. Where mine seems to be flexing is at the floor to the bulkhead. Like it needs braced towards the living quarters/cargo area. The frame on mine is double 2x8 box tubing run from axle mount to axle mount, then outriggers to a perimeter frame roughly 1x2x1/8 c channel. That's just there for mounting the skin. Uprights are on 16" centers. This has been a good trailer, with that flex as the only issue and it just bothers me more than creating a problem. Dave "It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell | |||
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| DRR S/Pro |
Chris, I hear ya. I'm looking at it as I doubt I have that many more years left to race. And don't do as many out of town races anymore. I'm thinking re-skinning it will make it look pretty again, and if I have the skin off it shouldn't be that hard to add some additional bracing to help the flex. I'm thinking some 1/8" flat sheet welded to the side and floor, and maybe some from the top to the goose floor as well Like a gusset. I had this trailer built to my spec's when I bought it so it wasn't just one off the lot. I don't charge myself labor so materials would be all that I'd have in it. By the way, how's your Dad doing? I have seen or talked to him in at least a couple of years Dave "It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell | |||
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| DRR Pro |
Dave, ole pop's is doing fine and I will tell him your were checking on him! | |||
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DRR Sportsman |
My stacker has a little flex on the gooseneck, but nothing that concerns me. This is not the best pic, but you can see the bracing I did.  stacker3 by neetchracer, on Flickr | |||
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| DRR Sportsman |
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| DRR S/Pro |
Nice, Mike. A few diagonals go a long ways in stiffing things up. 272" Spitzer 540 Chevy The Blower Shop XR1 FTI XPM Series Converter FTI Level 6 Powerglide 3.69@199 .916 60' 2017 Bradenton Heads Up Madness Open Outlaw Champ 2018 PDRA T/D #5 2019 PDRA T/D #2 2020 Retired From T/D Competition.... 2020 Bradenton NMCA Hemi Shootout Winner 2021 getting back into bracket racing with a Gen3 Hemi powered 87 Cutlass. | |||
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DRR Top Comp |
If it is flexing enough to crack then I would be concerned it is about to break completely and that would get ugly. I do not think 1/8 inch plate is going to be enough to strengthen it, it will flex in the middle under compression. It would help some under tension though. Depends on where and why it is moving. If it is flexing I would brace it and go overkill on it. I have seen some stupid things on trailers. Butt welds on critical areas, no bracing etc. With out seeing it can not be sure but it could easily be a warning sign of something bad. Most likely due to bad design from factory. https://postimg.cc/gallery/np3zpruo/ "Dunning-Kruger Effect" -a type of Cognitive bias where people with little expertise or ability assume they have superior expertise or ability. This overestimation occurs as a result of the fact that they do not have enough knowledge to know they don't have enough knowledge. Before you argue with someone ask yourself, "Is this person mentally mature enough to grasp the concept of a different perspective?" If not there is no point to argue. 4X NE2 CHAMPION. 2020 TDRA NE2 Champion | |||
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| DRR S/Pro |
You sir get the chicken dinner...…...  272" Spitzer 540 Chevy The Blower Shop XR1 FTI XPM Series Converter FTI Level 6 Powerglide 3.69@199 .916 60' 2017 Bradenton Heads Up Madness Open Outlaw Champ 2018 PDRA T/D #5 2019 PDRA T/D #2 2020 Retired From T/D Competition.... 2020 Bradenton NMCA Hemi Shootout Winner 2021 getting back into bracket racing with a Gen3 Hemi powered 87 Cutlass. | |||
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DRR Sportsman |
Not sure if its helpful or relevant, but the only thing I've ever bought brand new in my entire life was a 28' Haulmark Elite many years ago and it was the biggest POS I've ever seen. The side wall broke away from the bottom at just over a year and I had to bring it to Haulmark to fix under warranty. A few years later the other side wall broke away from the frame after it was out of warranty. The outside walls would get wavy anytime the nose was jacked up to unload, and I had numerous other problems over the years that were not normal wear & tear but just overall poor construction. I realize that I didn't buy a Gold Rush, but a trailers frame shouldn't completely fall apart after a few years of hauling a 1800lb dragster & golf cart. I would never buy another Haulmark anything & certainly wouldn't invest much time or money in one. Billy Duhs - BD104X@gmail.com | |||
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| DRR S/Pro |
As I said in the beginning this trailer was bought new in 2006. The crack is maybe 6 inches in the skin at the side cargo door at the upper corner. You can't see it unless you are looking for it and know where to look as it is hid by the awning. Curly I'm thinking 1/8 steel welded to each upright, the floor and bulkhead. Should stop any backward push on goose, then from the outside behind the diamond plate where the bracing already is I would add more or in different location, to stop upward flex. I'm thinking the 1/8" plate would act as a large shear plate in compression.!/8 in because of welding to each upright. Could go thicker, or use tubing instead like mike did. Mike, If I don't think a solid plate would work, I would do as you have only add several more. Also in the side cargo door area. Billy, I have owned 2 new Haulmark's over the years and for the price have been happy with them. Not perfect but no serious structural issues. I think the issue I'm concerned about could be remedied by a few additional braces. Reason for reskinning is because the paint is shot from sun and cleaning, and is ugly. I figured I would add some bracing while it was off. Dave "It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell | |||
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DRR Sportsman |
Just a bit of info, not generally done in the trailer industry. In the glass and glazing industry a technique used to install glass in hi rise bldgs is 4 sided structural glazing. In short, the glazing is held in place with structural glazing silicone and a 2 sided double stick tape is used as a spacer and to hold the glass at a proper spacing until the silicone fully cures. The trailer industry is skipping this silicone part, using a VHB tape only, that is very sticky, but lacks the capability to compensate for movement as it is very thin, so it has a tendency to shear. Add that in with poor installation practices, not cleaning the surfaces to be adhered, and rusty non prepped steel leads to failure. Buildings move, trailers move.You have to account for the flexing and stretching if you want stuff to stay put. The skeleton has to be able to move independent of the facade. | |||
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| DRR S/Pro |
That's interesting.. Dave "It is usually futile to try to talk facts and analysis to people who are enjoying a sense of moral superiority in their ignorance." -Thomas Sowell | |||
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Bracket Talk Bracket Talk Forum General Discussion - by FTI Gooseneck trailer skin cracking
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