Another thing I coach my son on: I could give two sh1ts about the damn "package" when it comes to finish line racing. What matters it what actions you took and how much stripe was taken and by who.......and ultimately the win light. You seldom have a nice looking package when you are cutting someone loose.

quote:

Originally posted by Paul S/Q:

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Bottom line is this, if you want to be a player, you and your car better be able to put together .015 packages and better at will.

THIS ^^^^^^

LOL! This is a very popular myth. Just for giggles, I grabbed the data from a random day of the OG Million, 2nd round. There were only 8 runs .015 total or better out of 162... less than 5%.

For YEARS, we've all heard, "Man, if you come to XYZ track, you need to be double-oh dead-on!" People only remember the stellar runs, and memory hole all of the average and garbage runs.

Does it HELP to be .015 or better all the time? Absolutely. As long as you park in the lanes right, you'd be not just a player, but completely dominate.

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Beard:

quote:

Originally posted by Paul S/Q:

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Bottom line is this, if you want to be a player, you and your car better be able to put together .015 packages and better at will.

THIS ^^^^^^

LOL! This is a very popular myth. Just for giggles, I grabbed the data from a random day of the OG Million, 2nd round. There were only 8 runs .015 total or better out of 162... less than 5%.

For YEARS, we've all heard, "Man, if you come to XYZ track, you need to be double-oh dead-on!" People only remember the stellar runs, and memory hole all of the average and garbage runs.

Does it HELP to be .015 or better all the time? Absolutely. As long as you park in the lanes right, you'd be not just a player, but completely dominate.

Good post. Numbers don't lie.

I like the days my winning packages are about .008 better than my opponents. I don't care what the packages are...as long as I was holding the better one. Other than that, it's just a process. If you pay attention, learn from losses you will get better.
See ya at the stripe ;-)


Jok

Sometimes I’ll dial honest, but when you’re dialed honest you’ll tend to have 3 options at the stripe:

1. Tighten it up
2. Stay in it out the back door
3. Let them go

I generally prefer to hold something because then I only have two options:

1. Tighten it up
2. Let them go

I’m usually able to execute better when I don’t need to spend any time deciding if just staying in it is the correct move. I need to kill; just need to worry about how much.

The most important thing while holding is knowing how to put your car dead-on. How much to hold, how to kill it, and where to kill it are all discovered though trial and error, and a lot of mistakes and lessons learned along the way.

Tony has it right for sure. Keep it simple and LEARN and PRACTICE.

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Beard:
I grabbed the data from a random day of the OG Million, 2nd round. There were only 8 runs .015 total or better out of 162... less than 5%.

How many of these 162 were .015 and better on the tree?

What I will say about holding, is that you have to know how to kill the numbers you are holding. You should practice holding in time trials. Pick a number you want to see your car run and kill enough on track to make it happen in a time run.

Holding can be a great tool to cover up your starting line mistake by making your opponent think you are presenting a better package than you really are. However if you don’t know how to kill the right amount of numbers after a bad light then holding is now useless. It’s also easy to get caught up in someone else’s game who is also holding. Maybe you did beat them on the tree and think you backed it in nice until the dump last minute. Again, you have to independently understand how to kill your numbers without always getting caught up in the race

There is no right answer, but again I stand by the fact that the time to learn it is during time trails

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
How many of these 162 were .015 and better on the tree?

67 hits, 41%

Thanks Michael, actually that is the kind of information that is helpful. You can always park next to the guy that's going .000 when he guessed right but I would take a .015 any day and work with it. The last 9 round race I got to the finals in I averaged .010 but mixed in there were a .000, .002 and worst of .021 when opponent was .047 (thank goodness!) Luck plays it's part for sure but you just have to be solid, run your race and be consistent with what you see and what you do in the last 150'.

Jok

You can find round by round race results from most major big money bracket events at https://dragstory.com/forum/index.php

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Beard:

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Bottom line is this, if you want to be a player, you and your car better be able to put together .015 packages and better at will.

LOL! This is a very popular myth. Just for giggles, I grabbed the data from a random day of the OG Million, 2nd round. There were only 8 runs .015 total or better out of 162... less than 5%.

True…but when you’re 006 and your opponent is 020+ you have plenty of room to make that package greater than .015

And to think, I used to actually like math. Fortunately for me, whether or not I am holding is as much of a surprise for me as it is for anyone else. Take care. Tom Worthington

quote:

True…but when you’re 006 and your opponent is 020+ you have plenty of room to make that package greater than .015

I think that is the point. Making your package tighter than it needs to be to win the round will win you fewer rounds statistically. The package size is pretty much pointless by itself.

Lots of ways to Win a round and more ways to Lose that round.
Holding gives you a chance to turn a possible losing round into a winner. May help you push your opponent into a breakout.

Yes if you could turn in an almost perfect run every time then you would not need to hold as much. In simple terms you must have a better package than your opponent, still nice to have more tools in your box to help you win. It lets you have a little more control of the race.

Even if you could make an almost perfect run every time holding some makes it harder for your opponent to know what your plan is and how to deal with it.

How much to hold? You need to get out there and do some testing and see what your car does.

My game plan changes from day to day or round to round.

I always go back to the Brett Kepner "always dial a number you know the car CAN run. The worst you think it could be that day, that's your number" Or something to that affect.
If you dial a 8.90, and run a 8.909, you didn't run the number. You were almost .01 off your dial, and you just add that right into your potential package before the run ever started IMO. Nothing you can do to get that .01 back. If you had dialed that car a 8.91, all you have to do is whisper at the brakes on a tighten up to be over your number. If you tend to hold a couple, and you are on a wheel to wheel run with someone, you know what you have to do. In fact, you always know what you have to do. The question is, how much.

What I hate is when I know the car is deadly, I'm on the tree and something else screws it up, track going away, wind etc.

That sucks!

quote:

Originally posted by markemark:

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Beard:

quote:

Originally posted by 1320racer:
Bottom line is this, if you want to be a player, you and your car better be able to put together .015 packages and better at will.

LOL! This is a very popular myth. Just for giggles, I grabbed the data from a random day of the OG Million, 2nd round. There were only 8 runs .015 total or better out of 162... less than 5%.

True…but when you’re 006 and your opponent is 020+ you have plenty of room to make that package greater than .015

As previously posted, only 41% of the R/T's were .015 or better -- which included both winners and losers. You cannot have a package better than .015 if your R/T is not.

I learned to hold the hard way, had the wrong numbers in my delay box and didn't realize it until after the race....I won it, but had to whomp the guy because I caught him WAY before I should have and knew something was wrong...so I stuck my nose in front of him and whomped it...I don't remember exactly what it was, but something like .15ish or so...it was a lot....

One thing that I've noticed though, is the faster the car, the harder it is to hold.....better to just have a consistent car and good reaction times.....

quote:

Originally posted by Bucky:
[QUOTE] The package size is pretty much pointless by itself.

That's not what SHE said....